Chivalry; yay or nay?

[emre43]

Firstly, I'm not very experienced in relationships with the opposite sex and the following may provide some reasoning as to why. I was just wondering what your opinions are on it; both guys and gals.

I think part of the problem why I suffer from social anxiety is that I feel that I don't fit into modern society. I'm not into pubs and clubs and all that stuff. I prefer romantic restaurants, strolling down a quiet Mediterranean promenade as the sun sets in the horizon and things like that.

When I eventually enter a relationship with a girl I want to make her know how special she is to me; I want her to be my soulmate, my best friend. To quote Donny Osmond "I'm just a little old fashioned, it takes more than a physical attraction".

I miss the days when ladies were ladies and gentlemen were gentlemen. I'm probably in the minority of one but I have read comments (that I won't repeat) online by guys about girls they like that are so vulgar that they appall me. They term the women as: whores, bitches, or simply it or that; show some courtesy for goodness sake.

I want my partner to be somebody incredibly special to me and I want to make sure that she knows it as well. I want to come home from work and every now and then surprise her with some flowers or chocolates. I want to have somebody who I can come to when I'm feeling blue to talk things through with and know that they they can trust me to do the same for them. I want to serenade my potential love interest with my six string and some beautiful romantic love songs, such as:

Elton John ~ Your Song - YouTube

Lucky Jim - Lovely to me - YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JxXKiSjgO8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH3HMBhzSag&feature=related
(Chose the Dylan version over Adele's because I'm a massive fan of his)

Just wondering whether anybody else misses the days of chivalry or whether it is just me?

 

[LazyHermitCrab]

i say, YAY

 

[Feathers]

I say YAY too - it's great that some from your generation think so too!!

There can be too much hostile speech in some places (at some bodybuilders' forums' or such especially...) It depends on the group of people I guess...
maybe you'd be more comfortable in a church group or such... (not only super-religious people in some of those...) or any other clubs/groups...

Just make sure you don't just recite poetry when dishes need to be done or such (someone I know threatened to do that to the love of his life, while she cooks and washes up and does it all!! The girls weren't so impressed lol)

Otherwise: chivalry YAY!!

 

[Moa]

Nay.

It shouldn't matter if you're male or female, we should ALL be polite to each other, 100% of the time.

But I also don't agree with the idea that "ladies should be ladies" and "gentlemen should be gentlemen". We don't get to choose our gender, so why should our gender dictate how we behave?

 

[Feathers]

hmm, Moa, I think he didn't say that everyone else needs to be impolite-??

'ladies' or 'gentleman' is also just one aspect of people - of course any individual has many more roles (and interests) than that...
I've heard some of that 'talk' he mentioned and well if every second word someone uses is a 'bleep' 'bleep' it's not very polite either??

 

[emre43]

Just make sure you don't just recite poetry when dishes need to be done or such (someone I know threatened to do that to the love of his life, while she cooks and washes up and does it all!! The girls weren't so impressed lol)

He he, I knew there would be some kind of stumbling block lol

 

[emre43]

hmm, Moa, I think he didn't say that everyone else needs to be impolite-??

'ladies' or 'gentleman' is also just one aspect of people - of course any individual has many more roles (and interests) than that...
I've heard some of that 'talk' he mentioned and well if every second word someone uses is a 'bleep' 'bleep' it's not very polite either??

Precisely.

 

[Moa]

hmm, Moa, I think he didn't say that everyone else needs to be impolite-??

'ladies' or 'gentleman' is also just one aspect of people - of course any individual has many more roles (and interests) than that...
I've heard some of that 'talk' he mentioned and well if every second word someone uses is a 'bleep' 'bleep' it's not very polite either??

Of course no one needs to be impolite, but that sure doesn't stop anyone, does it.

 

[megalon]

There's lots of space in between chivalry and misogyny. I don't agree with some antiquated practices of old-school chivalry like standing up when a women leaves the table and others like that but that doesn't mean I'm not polite. I'll still open doors. I often wonder what the origin was of certain things that are considered the polite thing to do, like no elbows on the table when eating. What difference does it make? I'm kinda straying off topic here I guess.

 

[doubleM]

i dont believe chivalry has any place in todays society. back in the 19th century and before, women were treated special....such as taking your hat off in their presence, standing up when they leave the table, helping them off of their vehicle or horse...but they also had a certain place in society then. no right to vote or own land, little say in the household, no say in government, etc. today its a different story, we believe in equality...or we say that at least. so, if you believe in equality, then what has a female done to deserve special chivalrous treatment from you?

im not trying to sound like a jerk, thats just how it is. i always treat all people that i meet politely and with respect. that includes females, but i no longer feel the need to treat them special. i behaved like a gentleman around them...never bring up sex, never talk dirty to them, hold doors open for them, etc. but this kind of treatment is viewed by women today as beta-male behavior, a doormat, or weak. granted there are exceptions, now i just dont care.
in this day and age, chivalry is null and useless.


**flame suit on**

 

[KiaKaha]

Nay.

It shouldn't matter if you're male or female, we should ALL be polite to each other, 100% of the time.

But I also don't agree with the idea that "ladies should be ladies" and "gentlemen should be gentlemen". We don't get to choose our gender, so why should our gender dictate how we behave?

Nay ^^ for this reason.

I just be nice to people, and treat people they way that I would like to be treated ...whilst giving them the freedom to be who they want to be.

 

[emre43]

Nay ^^ for this reason.

I just be nice to people, and treat people they way that I would like to be treated ...whilst giving them the freedom to be who they want to be.

But that wasn't the point that I was getting at. I agree that you should be polite to anybody anyway. But my point was that there are a lot of people that aren't polite. I was talking specifically about relationships because I'm not going to start singing 'Your Song' to a big sweaty male lol.

 

[emre43]

i dont believe chivalry has any place in todays society. back in the 19th century and before, women were treated special....such as taking your hat off in their presence, standing up when they leave the table, helping them off of their vehicle or horse...but they also had a certain place in society then. no right to vote or own land, little say in the household, no say in government, etc. today its a different story, we believe in equality...or we say that at least. so, if you believe in equality, then what has a female done to deserve special chivalrous treatment from you?

im not trying to sound like a jerk, thats just how it is. i always treat all people that i meet politely and with respect. that includes females, but i no longer feel the need to treat them special. i behaved like a gentleman around them...never bring up sex, never talk dirty to them, hold doors open for them, etc. but this kind of treatment is viewed by women today as beta-male behavior, a doormat, or weak. granted there are exceptions, now i just dont care.
in this day and age, chivalry is null and useless.


**flame suit on**

Firstly, women in Victorian times were treated like scum once they were married. Everything they owned became their husbands. If they refused their husband sex a stigma became attached to them. Since the suffragette movement they are still not treated equally. They earn less money then men despite being in the same job, obese women are faced with greater medical costs than men, they face sexual discrimination in the workplace, they are less likely to get into position's of authority (I can only think of Maggie Thatcher and Angela Merkel becoming state rulers) and it is very rare to hear of a man being raped by a woman. I'm not even sure if there is a masculine equivalent for misogyny. I'm not advocating going back to Victorian-style chivalry; nor did I say that anywhere; guitars weren't even invented then

It is very generalistic to say that all women view being polite as beta-male behaviour; in fact I would imagine that many would find it rude if you walked through a door and let it slam into their face behind you

I guess form a male point of view I hate the way we talk about them. I can remember sitting on the tube and a man was telling his friends how he was going to rape the girl that lived next door to him and all the things he was going to do to her. It made me feel as sick as a pig.

 

[doubleM]

Firstly, women in Victorian times were treated like scum once they were married. Everything they owned became their husbands. If they refused their husband sex a stigma became attached to them. Since the suffragette movement they are still not treated equally. They earn less money then men despite being in the same job, obese women are faced with greater medical costs than men, they face sexual discrimination in the workplace, it is very rare to hear of a man being raped by a woman. I'm not even sure if there is a masculine equivalent for misogyny. I'm not advocating going back to Victorian-style chivalry; nor did I say that anywhere; guitars weren't even invented then

i partly agree, but thats just what im getting at. men have their roles and women have theirs. taking on a victim mentality doesnt help their case. youre forgetting the parts about men having to pay huge amounts of child support and the courts always being on the mothers side, paternity fraud, etc.

It is very generalistic to say that all women view being polite as beta-male behaviour; in fact I would imagine that many would find it rude if you walked through a door and let it slam into their face behind you

remember i said there are exceptions. im not saying the entire female race views politeness as weakness. i dont know how it is where you are, but here in america thats how a large majority of western women view it...because they have been psychologically conditioned to believe it. (i think thats why.)

 

[MikeyC]

I don't think chivalry should die, but it shouldn't be as extreme as it was decades ago. I would certainly hold a door open for a lady or something, but I wouldn't take my hat off if one walked into the room. I think just mere politeness is the best.

 

[Tino]

Not enough women behave like ladies for the extreme stuff. You would look like a right wally taking your hat off when a ho enters the room. What next? Putting your cape on a puddle so she can stumble across it drunk?

 

[emre43]

i partly agree, but thats just what im getting at. men have their roles and women have theirs. taking on a victim mentality doesnt help their case. youre forgetting the parts about men having to pay huge amounts of child support and the courts always being on the mothers side, paternity fraud, etc.

I take your point on paternity fraud; however, in cases of paying child support I would expect that seeing as women aren't paid the same amount as men are + plus how many of the times are the father's complete jerks and it is their fault that the relationship ended in the first place?.

 

[doubleM]

I take your point on paternity fraud; however, in cases of paying child support I would expect that seeing as women aren't paid the same amount as men are.

assuming that all women make less money than men is a generalization.

 

[emre43]

assuming that all women make less money than men is a generalization.

It is yeah. But I meant women generally in the same position as men do earn less and it is quite a well-known fact.

 

[emre43]

You would look like a right wally taking your hat off when a ho enters the room.

That was everything that this thread was supposed to be against ::