Unknown Sample

What are you smoking? Can I have some?

Just kidding. I know what you mean about being bummed about the fact there there is "nothing new under the sun", to quote the bible, haha. It's true though. As far as we can tell, everything that can be thought has been thought, everything that can be feasibly done has been, every idea, every emotion, every experience. I mean, there are some things, like discovering life on another planet, or a new species here on earth, or whatever, but all the ideas that make up life are all already out there I think.
 

Odo

Banned
What are you smoking? Can I have some?

Just kidding. I know what you mean about being bummed about the fact there there is "nothing new under the sun", to quote the bible, haha. It's true though. As far as we can tell, everything that can be thought has been thought, everything that can be feasibly done has been, every idea, every emotion, every experience. I mean, there are some things, like discovering life on another planet, or a new species here on earth, or whatever, but all the ideas that make up life are all already out there I think.

But it could be just that we're all more restless and unwilling to content ourselves with these things... but at least science marches on. I still think there's a lot of untapped potential in things like mythology and spirituality and religion and things that aren't necessarily 'true' or cannot be grounded in tangible 'proof'. A lot of religiousness is flat out stupid and atheism places too much emphasis on the rational mind. I guess I'm yearning for a fresh spirituality, or like a spirituality that is empowering and unconcerned with money or truth or politics or even faith. Like the 'magical' world full of foreign lands and exotic parallels and mythological creatures that WS Burroughs wrote about in his Red Night Trilogy... I would love to find a world like that and shut up the rational parts of my mind that tell me it's not the way things work... something real and vivid yet also not real.
 

Odo

Banned
You're going to have to explain this to me.

Working in a hospital, no matter what you're doing, contributes to the health of citizens, even if you're not there using the defibrillator. And not everybody wants to be in that pressure situation, or is capable of doing that. I have to disagree about her not contributing, because perhaps in her mind she is, while also making a good chunk of money in the process.

Well, to be honest I wasn't even going to reply to this, but it's grating on me. Yes, all of these things contribute to the health of citizens. That's not my point.

My point is that it's not driving anything forward. If she wasn't doing it, someone else would be. It's not something that just one person could have done, and it's not something that lends itself to creativity or innovation... it's just that same mechanical process over and over, and the result is the same time and time again.

I don't want to hear any lectures about how everything is a team effort or how it's all valuable or anything like that... that applies to absolutely everything equally. I don't think it's actively negative-- it's not like advertising executives/copywriters or financial advisors, but it's not like it's so amazing that she deserves all the respect and credit in the world for it.

Again, this is your idea of success and personal achievement, which is different to your sister's, which is different to mine, and so on. I agree that teaching can be a very rewarding profession, but it's not for everyone.

Every time someone pulls out the 'it's all subjective' line like they've just won the top prize, I feel physically ill and communication in general seems that much more pointless. I seem to recall something similar happening the last time you called me out on something as well.

I don't think that teaching is necessarily 'better'-- in fact ESL teachers are considered to be particularly disposable because basically the only thing you need to get that job is a degree in anything and the extraordinary ability to have been born in an English speaking country... and really, it's a huge load of bullshit and I didn't really get the impression that the system would have ever even allowed me to do a really good job. In fact, if I had done a good job, I'm pretty sure my racist co-workers would have deliberately undermined me for the sake of their national pride, and because they don't want to be shown up by foreigners.

I was mostly saying that with regards to me doing 'better' for myself in my mother's eyes... and saying that it really isn't any better or worse than what my sister is doing. The money wasn't bad and on top of that the cost of living made up for it... I saved a lot more doing that than some people in New York City are saving on their 200k/year salaries, and I got to travel twice a year on top of that... but it wasn't worth the shittiness of daily living in that godawful country, and it wasn't such a special job that I felt like I was really doing something that couldn't be done as well or better by millions of other people.

I suppose that most jobs are like that, but I guess that's part of my point.
 

MikeyC

Well-known member
Right, so my opinion makes you "physically ill," communication seems "pointless," and you feel I'm so up myself because I decided to take the subjective route?

I'm sorry you feel that way. I won't bother you again.
 

Odo

Banned
^Well, I wouldn't say it's that extreme. I still respect you and think you're a good person and all of that, but yeah, I'm not going to miss your criticisms. They kind of miss the point... and I think I'm pretty good at criticizing myself so I don't need others to pile on.

And it's not your opinion in particular that makes me physically ill, it's that specific argument. There's nothing you can ever say to it and communication just dies, and everything becomes pretty much worthless.

Commenting is up to you... I can't control that.
 

Odo

Banned
I haven't been on here as much lately.

One reason for that is that I've been a lot happier over the past few weeks... I have reasons for that that I don't want to go into here. I'm pretty sure that if I felt like this place was worth it, I would keep coming here regardless of how happy I was. I probably still will, but hopefully less and less.

Cutting down on the SPW time is probably a positive thing because I felt like I was officially a fixture, and I was spending far, far too much time here. And I wasn't helping anyone, including myself.

I'm not sure if I care or not... I mean, I don't think I believe in the idea that 'it's just the Internet' and everyone on here is basically disposable or like a temporary substitute for real-life friends. I do think that there is something to online relationships... more than people usually let on. But I think a lot of others have that attitude and as a result, you're more likely to run into people who will just drop you whenever its convenient for them. Or maybe I'm projecting.

But then, I grew up when having online friends was a huge source of shame... it's really only in the past 10 years when it became more socially acceptable. I going to Asia and being an outsider means I ended up associating it with Asian culture without letting it become part of myself (at least, not in a way that didn't feel shameful). It was hard to get a sense of how much this was happening back home as well... so I guess in some ways I've missed the legitimization of the Internet as a means of making true connections. I wasn't completely cut off and depended on the Internet for culture and such... but yeah, it's hard to get a sense of what people have been talking about and what they've been interested in and the trends in fashion and such. All of that stuff I was aware of while abroad, but instead of Bieber I heard K-pop and sappy ballads in supermarkets and in public places... I just sort of tuned it out. I have never actually heard a Justin Bieber song, and I don't hate him because I honestly don't even know anything about him. I don't consider this a tragedy or anything... just an example of how I haven't been living here.

Yes indeedy.
 
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Odo

Banned
I'm in a power ballad mood. I want to call everyone baby, clench my fist, open my mouth and squeeze my eyes passionately shut.
 

Odo

Banned
The other night I saw the movie 'Love', about an astronaut who is stranded on a space station above the Earth. I don't know why it's called 'Love' since it's just about a guy being on his own and then some random interviews with people about things... the closest it comes to showing love is when there are some shots of a woman who is beautiful, but never speaks... and he lusts after her.

Even though I'm still a long way from being a filmmaker, if I was to make a film, this would be the one that I would be most afraid of making. It has all of the earmarks of the kind of movie I would like/love to make-- it's low budget, it's got an 'out-there' story, it's about isolation, it covers a long periods of time, it has a 'deep philosophical' script... but the problem is it's really bad.

It's not badly made or anything, it just doesn't make any sense and the ending is highly derivative. The acting isn't great either, but that's not really a problem compared to the story. None of it makes any sense... the point seems to be that isolation makes people crazy, which isn't exactly a deep truth of the universe-- and it's being overtly stated over and over again. He borrows the whispering/deep and manly voice-overs from Malick films, but it's all gibberish... it's a film about not making sense, and it doesn't make sense. He needs 'love', but it seems to be more like he needs human contact. And who is that woman? Seriously, that was driving me nuts. I kept thinking 'okay, he's horny' whenever she was on the screen... but the movie is called 'Love', so what the f--k?

And then he steals the ending from 2001: A Space Odyssey (spoilers but trust me you won't care)? How is that in any way a good idea? I mean, stealing from hip underground films like Tarantino does is one thing, but ripping off the one film that every single geek worships as the greatest ever made? It's like ripping off the crescendo from Day In The Life, or the coda from Hey Jude... or hell, the opening notes of Beethoven's fifth. Attaching it to the boring nonsense that preceded it makes it even worse... it's like he didn't know how to make the rest of it work so he made the ending weird or confusing, hoping someone would read something awesome into it.

It doesn't touch upon anything, and it does it in a boring way-- which is probably the worst thing that a film could do. There doesn't seem to be anything beneath the surface, which means it's pretentious.

I think that would be the worst kind of film to make. I would rather watch a stupid film that knows it's stupid than a pretentious one. I actually get kind of angry when I see really pretentious movies... Malick has been really churning out a lot of them lately. Tree of Life was on TV the other day and I was watching it thinking 'WTF is this shit?'. His secret weapon in the quest for profundity seems to be making them all whisper. Some of the performances were good, though... but it was like watching slides of someone's childhood or something.

But I guess that's the risk you take when you try to make something great. It's probably most important to know what you're good at before you spend half a million making your indie film, though.

One of the reasons I think I get so worked up about this type of movie is because I can see my own tastes in it and I can picture myself making this kind of film if I ever do find the money/ambition/drive. It's like meeting what Jung would call my shadow self... and taking offense because it has all of the negative qualities that I most suspect are true about myself. Like seeing a slightly distorted mirror, and not knowing which aspects of that reflection are a distortion and which are true.

Interestingly enough, we are apparently more likely to forgive these traits when we see them in someone of the opposite sex. I have noticed this trend in action for sure-- I think guys are really bad at accommodating negative qualities in women... but no, maybe it's true for women and men as well. But I've always pictured women being more likely to be critical of men than men of women. It happens, but I don't think it happens to the same extreme.

I think doing this undermines the whole concept of people as individuals and the world as being an ocean of possibilities and idiosyncratic energies, instead of just a plain boring binary system of genders that are supposed to respect each other or risk being labelled a man/woman-hater. I guess the same thing goes for racism, or any other kind of prejudice. Part of not being sexist/racist is being able to feel comfortable hating someone of another race or gender because of who they are.
 
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Odo

Banned
I've been working on a new script based on what I've been reading in Syd Field's book 'Screenplay', which is an excellent book on writing in general, for the way it lays out the elements of a good script without talking too much about the specifics.

The general idea here is that once you have the characters, the major plot points and are able to encapsulate your story in a very short description, the story/screenplay writes itself.

The most helpful exercise in the book is where he advises you to write out the histories of your characters before the story begins, so that you can know how to better write for them. It makes the story you want to tell richer if you understand who these people are before you put them together... I had always had difficulties with characterization but this exercise helped me a LOT.

Anyways, what you would do is think of how these people developed through roughly each decade of their lives, so you would start at 0-10, then 10-20, then 20-30, etc. It's kind of a convenient, nicely structured way of looking at things because each of these decades helps to move the character forward into the next, and informs how they will deal with each stage of their lives.

Anyways, I started doing that and I came up with this character that made me think about just how much it is possible for a person to change over the course of their life, the catalysts that bring those changes about, and also how quickly or slowly these changes can happen. I realized that I truly do believe that even if you dig yourself into a hole over the course of a decade, you can have a single really good year with lots of catalysts and end up digging yourself out of it completely.

One of the most annoying, frustrating things about some people on this forum is that they're usually stagnant... it's the same bullshit over and over and over, and even through a handful of minor victories, they never win or move forward, and what's more they're constantly pushing themselves back into their comfort zones through cynicism and anger and volatility and fear. But really, they just haven't found their catalysts... or they haven't taken a real look at themselves/confronted themselves/called themselves out on their own bullshit.

I think that people see falling in love as a major catalyst, and I think that's true... there is this great film by the director of Take Shelter and Mud called Shotgun Stories, where a man is a louse for the first part of his life and fathers three children he doesn't even bother to properly name, and then leaves his wife completely cleans up his life and fathers three more children who are given everything and love him as an upstanding provider who has led them to success. I think the overall impression we're left with is that there was a perfect convergence of forces in his life and finding a better woman is probably a major part of that.

I know it's just a movie, but I love the idea of being able to massively reform your own existence like that... it seems plausible from a narrative standpoint, and it's inspiring to imagine that someone could have that kind of drive. In some ways, it's something that I always thought would happen to me but didn't... and maybe that made me more passive than I should have been.

Also, looking at character development in terms of decades makes you realize that changes happens slowly as well as quickly. Young people are impatient and seem unhappy with anything but great, spontaneous changes that reform their entire consciousness in the blink of an eye-- like falling in love or getting a job or the buzz they get when they first start working out-- and while those things help, it's the little steps in the right direction that have the greatest effect... it's not immediate, it happens over time... it's the not giving up that makes it work.

So yeah, not sure what I'm getting at, exactly... just that it's a good book and writing up the backstories has made me think about life in a more structured, cinematic way... and given me a grasp of how things snowball or don't snowball or grow or die or whatever.
 

Odo

Banned
I have decided that today I'm going to talk about selfishness.

It's one of my favorite topics, I think... because of being unemployed for some months without really making an effort to get a job, and even though I've been studying web development, I definitely haven't been putting 100% into it. In fact, it has been really slow and I've been distracted for a large part of that.

My biggest distractions from that until recently were wanting to make a film and wanting to escape/buy land... I spent soooo much time reading about solar power and concrete and cob and how global warming is going to change things and mining in Northern Ontario (trying to find clean land)-- more than I spent studying web development, which is actually boring as shit and not at all satisfying on any level. I actually hate being in front of the computer all the time, being **** about tiny mistakes or trying to dissect all the complicated bullshit of code. I suppose in many ways, I feel like I've been extremely lazy but that's not true... I just haven't been forcing myself to do something I hate.

And I've been thinking lately about whether or not I really want to get a job and make money. I mean, I definitely haven't been applying myself. I have to admit, living at home is easy, apart from the isolation.

And another confession... I actually have a girlfriend now. Of course it's just an online thing, but still... it's someone who is always there. And the thing is, like this, I have all of the time in the world to give and receive love. If we were closer together, I honestly think I would have absolutely no reservations about spending every single moment with her and not giving a **** about whether or not I'm contributing to society.

I was somewhat driven by guilt and fear in the past, but I am coming to realize just how much of that guilt and fear was due to being alone/not feeling like I was good enough for anyone else. But now all of that has been removed, and while there are things I would like to accomplish, really, if they didn't happen I wouldn't feel bad about it. The only thing I would feel bad about is losing my girlfriend.

Now, aside from this probably not being realistic in terms of living situations in the long run, I have thought about whether or not I could ever be happy living in a bubble-- and my answer is always yes. I have thought about whether I could be happy knowing I hadn't really contributed to society, and the answer is again, yes. There are stories I would like to tell and things I would like to do... but then, I look at films and music and such, and it all seems like an oppressive wall of noise, everyone struggling to be heard. If I could have a small community and be recognized there, it would mean so much more.

Fear and weakness keep me in society, but also I think the fact that I do benefit from what it provides... and the fact that it's hard to find a community without being in society. I also think it's probably just the fact that I like being comfortable, and hate being afraid. But maybe it wouldn't even feel like that if I actually did it. Ha ha I'm worse than Hamlet at committing to things I intend to do.

So yes, I would feel guilty for taking from society and not giving back... and the thing is, I think I'll always need doctors and supermarkets and such, unless I start learning how to actually do all of these things I keep telling myself i want to do.

I want to tell myself I would be okay with going on welfare, but I REALLY don't want to lose my savings OR end up depending on a government forever, not because it's morally wrong but because they could take it away if things went south. I don't mind being a little poor/having 'just enough', but I do mind not being free... not that I'm free now.

I read an article about a guy who survives on 7k/year in his savings... but he has a lot of backup money too just in case. I couldn't afford that for the rest of my life... not if I bought land as well. I would have no safety net!!
 
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Odo

Banned
Also:

I have this idea to make an anxiety retreat on rural land.

There are anxiety retreats out there where people stay in a mansion or whatever, but I think this would be more like a detox where people just stay in simple accommodation or go camping. The only problem would be convincing people to go all the way up there... but maybe if we had a van or something, it could work.

Another problem of course is that everyone on here is so spread out.... it would have to be a local thing. But I think there's just going to be more anxiety in the future, not less... so it might have a lot of growth potential.
 
Also:

I have this idea to make an anxiety retreat on rural land.

There are anxiety retreats out there where people stay in a mansion or whatever, but I think this would be more like a detox where people just stay in simple accommodation or go camping. The only problem would be convincing people to go all the way up there... but maybe if we had a van or something, it could work.

Another problem of course is that everyone on here is so spread out.... it would have to be a local thing. But I think there's just going to be more anxiety in the future, not less... so it might have a lot of growth potential.
^Another problem with that idea is that many people with anxiety are very poor.
They are just surviving on welfare, be it unemployment or disability payments, or stuck in minimum wage jobs.

Therefore many would not have any extra money to spare to pay for their stay at this retreat. Even if you just charge them enough to cover food etc, many would not have any spare cash to pay for their transport out to the rural retreat.

Its a great idea, only many of us would not be able to afford it. :sad:
 
Also:

I have this idea to make an anxiety retreat on rural land.

There are anxiety retreats out there where people stay in a mansion or whatever, but I think this would be more like a detox where people just stay in simple accommodation or go camping. The only problem would be convincing people to go all the way up there... but maybe if we had a van or something, it could work.

Another problem of course is that everyone on here is so spread out.... it would have to be a local thing. But I think there's just going to be more anxiety in the future, not less... so it might have a lot of growth potential.

Sounds awesome. As long as there's ghost stories being told around the campfire I'm in!
 

Odo

Banned
^Another problem with that idea is that many people with anxiety are very poor.
They are just surviving on welfare, be it unemployment or disability payments, or stuck in minimum wage jobs.

Therefore many would not have any extra money to spare to pay for their stay at this retreat. Even if you just charge them enough to cover food etc, many would not have any spare cash to pay for their transport out to the rural retreat.

Its a great idea, only many of us would not be able to afford it. :sad:

Yes, I thought about that... and really, you don't need special land to just go camping in Canada!

So I could either target the parents of anxious kids who might have enough money for that kind of thing, or find people who are actually willing to abandon their hectic modern lives and start a cult... or commune, yes, commune.
 

Odo

Banned
Sounds awesome. As long as there's ghost stories being told around the campfire I'm in!

Actually, I was going to dress up as Jason and jump out and surprise everyone at night.

But hey, thanks for liking my idea!
 

Odo

Banned
I have been getting so much stupider since I started my current relationship.

I seriously think that the degree to which I love this girl has a very significant correlation with the high amount of stupidity that has invaded my brain. I'm not complaining of course, but yeah... I'm getting dumber. I think this must be why married people get breaks... because everyone knows that when you are in love you can't do as much stuff.

Or maybe it's just that caring about someone has made it harder for me to fall into my own neuroses-- I keep getting swept away in what David Hasselhoff would call the current of love, and all the channels of my brain are flooded, and there are sea creatures swimming in them. And the sea creatures are eating all of my neurotic thoughts and turning them into fertile soil in which more and more amazing things grow.

So yeah, I am currently infatuated beyond the infinite and I have never before been so completely stupidly insanely into someone ever in my life. How many different ways can I say this without it getting boring? I think describing this kind of thing would involve hallucinatory Burroughs cutup language (sans cynicism/sadomasochism/homosexuality) right at the point where it progresses past my ability to express it... and this thing is a gargantuan iceberg with most of it buried deep in my subconscious, and possibly down towards the Earth's core like porous rock with pulsating psychedelic stalactites from some 1960s Technicolor sci-fi and bubbles from where the contents release ever so slightly over the course of millions of years.

And for all of you young whippersnappers out there who may have been bold enough to venture into my crusty old thread-- let this serve as a reminder that you can always find things to make you happy as long as you don't pretend to be something you're not and don't shut yourself off... I'm almost 36 and I've been rendered a giddy teenager who can't control his hardons, and while social retardation such as this would have been painful in the past, I've since become immune to all stigma and actually welcome it with a open glad heart that does not give a **** about much of anything outside of the one I love.

This is my very candid and very uncharacteristically loopy confession... make of it what you will-- but I feel I have finally found the perfect combination of maturity, immaturity, experience, insight, chemistry, likemindedness, compassion, understanding, communication and so much beauty it's like the anti-Medusa has turned me into whatever the opposite of stone is-- possibly jelly, or maybe something slightly more aqueous which definitely has observable density and mass but which solids can pass completely through. Yep, I'm becoming a puddle. A stupid puddle that sleeps in a soft bucket with a stupid smile ever rippling on its face.
 
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