Bitter about being unattractive

[twiggle]

There is no reason there should be a 50%+ divorce rate in this country.

Same figure as here in the UK ::

It doesn't make me as excited about marriage as I was when I was a young girl using teddies as bridesmaids and marrying my NKOTB posters.

 

[Felgen]

I don't get why whenever someone brings up the "nice guy" term, people try to twist it to make it sound like I must be talking about a push-over who is needy, worrying all the time, and always thinks he did something wrong?

There are plenty of nice guys who aren't needy, don't worry all the time and are confident in themselves. These same guys may be kind of quiet, which doesn't mean they aren't confident, yet women seem to perceive them as not confident just because don't blab away like those super outgoing guys.

My complaint is more along the lines of that. Of course a guy who is needy is not attractive, but what about the guy who isn't needy and just doesn't like to talk that much. It seems many women write him off as a loser just because he doesn't have a million things to say.

I wasn't saying all outgoing guys are jerks, most arent. I was just saying that it's stupid that a guy can just be super outgoing and even if he's a total jerk and winds up beating or cheating on his women, he'll get a lot of women compared to a nice guy who doesn't like to say as much but really treats women with respect and won't beat her or cheat on her.

Let's face it, this problem goes beyond these nice, respectful guys not getting dates. I think it's a national problem here in the USA. It's this westernized crap that says that men must be this cocky guy from the movies who has a million things to say. It's all about talking instead of who he is as a person.

I think it's a problem with people in general. People are marrying way way way too much. There is no reason there should be a 50%+ divorce rate in this country. It's not just about the parents lives being messed up, but it effects the kids too. I've heard older people talk about how things didn't used to be like this. Columbine, Vtech, Arkansas and that recent Ohio shooting......this crap didn't happen back in the day. I blame the parents because they don't think. They choose their partners unwisely, then they marry too early and then they really screw up when they try to have these kids when they aren't fit to be parents. Then they get divorced, and the kids' heads get messed up.

It becomes more about the parents trying to be their kids' friend instead of being a parent when that divorce happens. The hate that happens between parents trickles down to the children and can lead to issues with the child at school. It's the worst example someone can set, to show your kid that you got married when you shouldn't of. What's the kids supposed to think, I want to be just like dad and make bad decisions? I don't understand how they are supposed to function in that enviornment.

Good post.

If it makes you feel any better, movies and magazines dictate courting rules in Norway as well.

 

[Felgen]

You know what I have noticed too, is these "nice guys" that complain that girls never go for them, they aren't going for the "nice girls". They are going for the really pretty girls who aren't that nice either. I mean if she was such a great girl, she'd like you for you.

I like nice girls. Niceness is a genetic trait that most men desire in a woman, thus it's considered attractive.

(The prettiest girls tend to be very nice, though.)

 

[Hoppy]

(The prettiest girls tend to be very nice, though.)

A girl that is nice is pretty. A girl that is very nice is beautiful.

 

[OceanMist]

I like nice girls. Niceness is a genetic trait that most men desire in a woman, thus it's considered attractive.

(The prettiest girls tend to be very nice, though.)

Yeah, I'm not sure where the pretty girl=mean girl stereotype came from? Maybe another media/movie thing that people have brought into the real world and assumed it to be true?

Any woman can be nice no matter what she looks like. Same thing with men. I can't stand when I hear people say, "Oh, she's hot so she must treat other people badly." That's a load of crap. People that say that stuff have been mind-warped by those Jersey Shore and Real Housewives shows.

Anyway, I agree with your post. I like nice women, and so do most other guys. It's a good trait.

 

[OceanMist]

If it makes you feel any better, movies and magazines dictate courting rules in Norway as well.

I'm sorry to hear that. I wish more people could just think for themselves but it doesn't like that's going to happen any time soon. The media seems to be warping people more and more.

 

[coyote]

I think it's a problem with people in general. People are marrying way way way too much. There is no reason there should be a 50%+ divorce rate in this country. It's not just about the parents lives being messed up, but it effects the kids too. I've heard older people talk about how things didn't used to be like this. Columbine, Vtech, Arkansas and that recent Ohio shooting......this crap didn't happen back in the day. I blame the parents because they don't think. They choose their partners unwisely, then they marry too early and then they really screw up when they try to have these kids when they aren't fit to be parents. Then they get divorced, and the kids' heads get messed up.

It becomes more about the parents trying to be their kids' friend instead of being a parent when that divorce happens. The hate that happens between parents trickles down to the children and can lead to issues with the child at school. It's the worst example someone can set, to show your kid that you got married when you shouldn't of. What's the kids supposed to think, I want to be just like dad and make bad decisions? I don't understand how they are supposed to function in that enviornment.

i think the problem is that we've been conditioned to believe that marriage and/or monogamy is the end all be all of relationships

Our modern concept of two people raising their children under one roof grew out of feudal necessity. The absolute minimum number of people necessary to maintain a plot of land during the Middle Ages was two. As the lord of the land wanted his serfs to "be fruitful and multiply" (thus multiplying the wealth of the lord), it was necessary that one of the two people be a man and the other a woman. Serfs were paired until death did them part. Love had nothing to do with it. (The only people who had time for such luxuries as love were those in the royal court—hence the term courtship.) The man tended the land all his waking hours, and the woman tended the house, livestock, and children. Even if a husband and wife hated each other, all they had to do was wait a little while: what with disease, war, childbirth, and an average life span of about thirty-five years, most marriages lasted less than five years. The departed partner was immediately replaced, and the system continued—not because the serfs liked it, but because it was economically viable for the aristocracy.

The system worked so well and the aristocracy was so pleased, they got the church involved. A marvelous theology developed (marvelously useful to the landowners): work hard in this life (which is but a blink in the eye of eternity), serve your lord (who represented the Lord), and you will have paradise for all eternity—and that's a long, long, time Mr. and Mrs. Serf. Rebel against the lord (Lord), and you will spend all eternity (which is a long, etc.) in hell. Be true to your spouse (not being true to your spouse would take valuable time away from essential serf stuff), work hard, and eternal paradise will be yours.

When it comes to professional relationships, the law recognizes just about every kind. In business, there are sole proprietorships, limited partnerships, corporations, and any number of other government (and, more important, IRS) recognized relationships. The laws and customs are neatly in place for mergers, takeovers, creating, and dissolving professional relationships of all shapes, sizes, and durations.

Why is it, then, when it comes to personal relationships, there is only one legally recognized, community approved, IRS sanctioned relationship: one man and one woman promising fidelity until one of them dies? Only in this relationship—known as marriage—do people get the tax breaks, bank loans, realtor acceptance, and Welcome Wagon visits.

If business law had an equivalent to the laws concerning personal relationships, it would say, "If you're in business, you must have one partner, and only one partner, and keep that partner, until one of you dies." If this were the law, can you imagine the state of business in America? The same is true of the state of personal relationships.

If we allow people to follow their hearts (and what else should they primarily follow in romantic relationships?) and allow relationships the freedom to grow, dissolve, merge, and interact with the same legal freedoms and protections we give business, then everyone—including (and perhaps especially) those who want a traditional marriage—would be a lot better off.

- from Ain't Nobody's Business If You Do, by Peter McWilliams

 

[Kiwong]

I fell in love with a girl who was kind to me. She was a nice person, and very beautiful but my love interest was unrequited. It shattered me and I have lost confidence in approaching people at all. That one rejection has contributed to my anxiety.

 

[KiaKaha]

I prefer monogamy - its too psychologically exhausting being with more than one person, I would rather invest myself emotionally into just a single person because its rewarding, respectful and it also feels good .... I also dont tolerate being cheated on, thats happened before to me and its an awful feeling.

Marriage I am not sure about though - but thats not exactly the same as monogamy.

 

[coyote]

I prefer monogamy - its too psychologically exhausting being with more than one person, I would rather invest myself emotionally into just a single person because its rewarding, respectful and it also feels good .... I also dont tolerate being cheated on, thats happened before to me and its an awful feeling.

Marriage I am not sure about though - but thats not exactly the same as monogamy.

but see, if you allow for something other than monogamy, then people don't have to "cheat"

there's nothing necessarily wrong with monogamy, or marriage, for that matter

but maybe it's just not the best fit for everyone

particularly in a society that likes to think it's so open and accepting

 

[Lexington]

I prefer monogamy - its too psychologically exhausting being with more than one person, I would rather invest myself emotionally into just a single person because its rewarding, respectful and it also feels good .... I also dont tolerate being cheated on, thats happened before to me and its an awful feeling.

Marriage I am not sure about though - but thats not exactly the same as monogamy.

And physically!

 

[KiaKaha]

but see, if you allow for something other than monogamy, then people don't have to "cheat"

Oh yeah, I know - if its consensual and all out in the open - then hey, why not go for it... if thats what you want - Its not going to hurt anyone, and its not my place or anyone elses to say otherwise - if people want to be in polyamorus relationships or practice polygamy - then I say go hard.

Its only when secrets, deception and feelings of betrayal become involved - thats when it starts to hurt. Call me old fashoned but I dont think I am emotionally equipped for that - a one woman kind of guy is how I operate - and for me personally I would find that more fufulling and rewarding - dont get me wrong I am not a prude or anything and open for sexual experimentation (so to speak) - its just investing emotionally into someone and making only one person feel loved, protected and important is richer and more satisfying.

At least...thats how I feel.... anyway... I will shut up now.

 

[Iluv]

but see, if you allow for something other than monogamy, then people don't have to "cheat"

I knew some people in an open relationship, two days later they both accused each other of cheating. :: . I was like THATS THE WHOLE POINT. IMO, it doesn't work out unless you're okay with not ever finding the one.. I'm more of that person who thinks when you find your soulmate, that's it. More for monogamy I guess but it's an interesting debate all together!

 

[coyote]

or as Oscar Wilde said...

“Bigamy is having one wife too many. Monogamy is the same.”

 

[Aletheia]

fortuitous opening

its too psychologically exhausting being with more than one person, I would rather invest myself emotionally into just a single person because its rewarding, respectful and it also feels good

I've always felt that way too, but the problem is that I do invest myself emotionally into just a single person. Because I end up looking to him for everything in my life, I don't bring new material in from other sources, and the relationship can begin to feel stagnant. If I'm in the role of "girlfriend", I always fear I'm not living up to it, that I'm not good enough, that I can't be everything to him, which I find incredibly stressful.

Even worse, because he becomes everything to me, the fear of losing that everything becomes overwhelming. I can't bear to have that fear hanging over my head, and I sabotage the relationship. I run away.

I need to find a new, more balanced way of approaching intimacy, and I think that means a less structured, less tightly defined approach, so that there's no "role" for me to fear failing to fufill. It may mean multiple lovers, or at least the potential for them, so that we don't have to be everything to each other.

 

[Aletheia]

Plus I need to invest more energy into other areas of my life, including figuring out how to keep platonic friendships alive, when there's no sexual glue.

 

[Aletheia]

marital duties

And physically!

Big Love

 

[Aletheia]

I dont think I would be particularly interested in a girl that was over the top needy and insecure either. Thats not fun.

Anxiety is love's greatest killer. It makes others feel as you might when a drowning man holds on to you. You want to save him, but you know he will strangle you with his panic.

(Anaïs Nin)

 

[Aletheia]

That one rejection has contributed to my anxiety.

::

I'm so sorry.

 

[Candide]

I guess acne and being "heavy" makes me feel pretty bitter and strike out at people....