Do humans tend to be more collective or individualistic?

[Srijita52]

So this is one of the weird thoughts that I'm having lately. I might make little or no sense at all, it might as well be just a stupid ramble so I apologise in advance.

As most of us know or at least taught that humans are social creatures. Its somewhat true I guess since we have some social morals, values and beliefs that we tend follow more or less, maybe this comes from a desire to be accepted by the society, by the people around us (there're always exceptions too of course) But if we notice our actions we'll see that although they seem social at the surface there're many individual motives behind them. Its like all of us are unique and at the very same time collective. So I was wondering what might describe us best? Are we more social and collective or unique and individualistic?

I'm never good at explaining whatever is on my mind. I'm not sure if I'm making sense now haha. Thanks for reading.

 

[SilentBird]

I think your question makes sense to me. I hope my responses reflect that.

I say mostly a tendency for the former while still having room for the latter. Most people seem to want to feel connected with people, to belong and to cooperate. Some people feel shunned and isolate themselves. Some choose to isolate theselves anyway, they prefer it that way.

Even many who feel uncomfortable with people seek avenues to connect. Even I who feels alienated at the best of times yearns to connect and relate to people.

Ideally humans can be collective while their individuality exists. Like you say all of us are unique and at the same time collective.

 

[Boby]

I think every social-collective action has a selfish reason behind it.
We evolved as a very social specie because of the benefits that each individual will get,but this doesn't explain the individualism we see today because our social behaviour and it's selfish benefits are controlled by our genes (is in our instinct to be social)not by ourselves.
So from where does the individualism comes?I think it's from our rational part of the brain,the part which is instinct free.Rationality allows any type of behaviur to emerge including individualism.
So in conclusion I think it's in our instinct(genes) to be social while our rationality makes us unique/individualist.

 

[coyote]

individualism has always been highly prized in America

we have this romantic notion of the lone pioneer, thumbing his nose at authority and tradition, striking out for parts unknown to carve out a better life for himself

the whole country was created by loners, outcasts, and miscreants

individualism has become such a part of our national consciousness that it has created a paradox in which society lauds the very people who reject it

so much of American literature and film-making involves a lone hero single-handedly battling the dark forces of the local establishment that society has allowed to come into power

it's impossible to be completely individualistic and still fit into society with all its rules and expectations - yet we tell ourselves, culturally, that we should aspire to that

no wonder we're all so confused about our role in society and how we should behave

 

[WeirdyMcGee]

The documentary 'I AM' has a theory about people.
Theory goes: we used to be collective-- one with everyone, with everything; like the aboriginal peoples-- but as time went by, we lost touch with ourselves and became individuals. We became cold and closed to everything.


You can actually watch all 3 parts of the movie on youtube if you're curious.
The trailer was shown on Oprah-- so mom (being a big Oprah fan) wanted us to rent it when it came out.
It's pretty interesting.
"I AM" the Movie Pt 1 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube
"I AM" the Movie Pt 2 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube
"I AM" the Movie Pt 3 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube

 

[Srijita52]

I think every social-collective action has a selfish reason behind it.
We evolved as a very social specie because of the benefits that each individual will get,but this doesn't explain the individualism we see today because our social behaviour and it's selfish benefits are controlled by our genes (is in our instinct to be social)not by ourselves.
So from where does the individualism comes?I think it's from our rational part of the brain,the part which is instinct free.Rationality allows any type of behaviur to emerge including individualism.
So in conclusion I think it's in our instinct(genes) to be social while our rationality makes us unique/individualist.

I agree that we evolved as a social specie because of the benifit of each individual and its our basic instinct to be social. I think we tend to be selfish for our own exitense, maybe that's why society was formed in the first place as its impossible for one individual to be completely self sufficiant.

it's impossible to be completely individualistic and still fit into society with all its rules and expectations - yet we tell ourselves, culturally, that we should aspire to that

Agreed, its impossible to be absolutely individualistic and fit into society, all of us need to control our desires and inclinations to a point.

 

[Srijita52]

The documentary 'I AM' has a theory about people.
Theory goes: we used to be collective-- one with everyone, with everything; like the aboriginal peoples-- but as time went by, we lost touch with ourselves and became individuals. We became cold and closed to everything.


You can actually watch all 3 parts of the movie on youtube if you're curious.
The trailer was shown on Oprah-- so mom (being a big Oprah fan) wanted us to rent it when it came out.
It's pretty interesting.
"I AM" the Movie Pt 1 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube
"I AM" the Movie Pt 2 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube
"I AM" the Movie Pt 3 of 3 (26 Minutes) - YouTube

Interesting. Thanks for the links.

 

[Gaucho]

the human race is egoistic

 

[Canis lupus]

Your question made me think of a statement made by Spinoza:

"By their urge to self-preservation and pursuit of happiness, people are naturally inclined to think in the first place about themself – they are born selfish."

In my opinion people only become more collective when they meet people with the same ideas and values as themself. Anyone who's a little bit different or people they don't know don't matter. So for me people are definitaly more individualists.

 

[Roman Legion]

Reminded me of this song..

L7 - Pretend We're Dead - YouTube

But the expression "People are sheep" is true, people for the most part have to feel as if they belong, I don't know why, they just do. People will follow anyone anywhere and do anything to remain part of the group. We on the outside that find comfort away from this are basically persecuted and they try to make us "normal". My opinion anyway as I have seen it personally..

 

[EscapeArtist]

I feel like we are more collective. I think most people would sacrifice their lives for the lives of their family members if they have close family. Although it is very easy to be more individualistic in modern day because there is a lot of separation of the family unit (the tribe). What people call "Life" gets in the way. What they mean is the stress of a world adapting faster than we can. Our coping mechanisms have changed, and we may turn inwards into ourselves rather than to the family for support, growing distant from the concept of going through troubles as a group. Why do we turn inwards instead of to a group? Well, at this point, we have been raised by people who do the same.

Also, there is a lot of outside force now, pulling us in every which direction and confusing our signals of bonding, concepts of self and identity. We are using some of this tribe-protection-collective-whatever energy automatically on all of humanity. Now instead of just caring for the tribe we view all of humanity as part of us, our "team", despite the fact that we feel little connection to humanity as a collective, it is not ingrained in us as deeply (in comparison to the tribe). Then consider that there are so many different opinions and directions that seperate humanity into little subgroups. It makes some of mankind seem more 'wrong' or more 'right', give people the choice to leave others (which would not happen in tribe often). In tribe, you leave, you die! You have an opinion different, there is no outside source to support it or make it feel right or welcome. In society, all paths are supported to some extent. The concept of the whole collective thing is lost, partially. We become desensitized

I perosnally believe this is somewhat responsible for the appeal of cults. When you join a cult, you fulfill the need for tribe again. At the same time, the brainwashing of people to all think the same thing is welcome because it makes the tribe your whole world, there are no separate ways, so much like the tribe the choice of the group is always the right choice because they deny the acceptance of outside judgement (again not something present in our ancestry...). This gives one the feeling of being one with a group in a way that is closer than the norm in mass society. People in cults seem willing to die for their 'family' because they have become the collective. I'm not saying that cults are right or that cults totally mock our nature, but just that the appeal of the cult is the appeal of our nature of being more collective than individual

It's a combination of not having a trustworthy, loyal, deeply intimate group of support that one can put "forever" into and thus fully trust and be one with, combined with the desperation of not being adapted to an envrionment causing pain and an emergency response that makes a person grab for themselves before others. Of course it's easy to lose the collective nature if you don't feel the natural fulfillment of it that has been so ingrained in us in our ancestry...

 

[gustavofring]

I read something interesting in a book about human ego's and how they can shift from a personal ego to a collective ego (a company, a country, a football team, etc.)

Then the collective ego becomes an extension of the person's ego. A collective ego manifests the same characteristics as the personal ego, such as the need for conflict and enemies, the need for more, the need for superiority, etc.

 

[MikeyC]

Its like all of us are unique and at the very same time collective.

Yes. If I was more collective, I wouldn't be listening to extreme heavy metal. But then again, sometimes it's good to be collective for social reasons.

To answer your question, a little from column A, a little from column B.

 

[Gaucho]

I read something interesting in a book about human ego's and how they can shift from a personal ego to a collective ego (a company, a country, a football team, etc.)

Then the collective ego becomes an extension of the person's ego. A collective ego manifests the same characteristics as the personal ego, such as the need for conflict and enemies, the need for more, the need for superiority, etc.

hey,

that would be communism, imo. it hast worked as a system in the history so far talking about a country.

 

[Lea]

I feel hard to imagine what you mean by "collective" and "individualistic", I think I would need at least one example. I think everyone should and does at least to an extent comply with social rules, like for example having good maners, saying "sorry" if you run into someone in the crowd by mistake, coming on time on appointments, wear (or don´t wear) certain clothes for certain occasions and such little things, which are considered almost automatic.. if someone didn´t respect even the most basic rules of society, they would be seen as a complete weirdo (or fallen from the moon) and possibly end up in a mental asylum.

But besides of this, even at the same time, one can practice individuality.. you can follow your unique vision for example, or do something which makes you stand out of the crowd, but at the same time, you ARE in the crowd and one of them and have to abide by their basic rules.

So these 2 things that I described don´t negate each other, on the contrary. They need to effectively complement each other, work together.

But maybe I didn´t understand the question right and ramble about something else..

 

[Kiwong]

As a species humans are pragmatic creatures who's survival depends on forming social groups.

 

[Lea]

It got me also thinking about collective consciousness, which animals have. By them it´s all collective consicousness, they somehow draw information from the common pool. Whereas people are cut off from the pool of collective consciousness and have individual consciousness instead (maybe not completely or each of them is connected to the collective consciousness to a different extent).

 

[bleach]

compared to what? animals? humans are clearly more collectivistic than animals. animals will never cooperate with others besides close kin. some animals will never cooperate with others, complete loners. humans cannot even survive without cooperating in large groups because our developmental periods are so long.

 

[SilentBird]

Imagine a world comprised entirely of eccentrics? That would be interesting, and exciting.