Being a man

[KiaKaha]

I have been doing some thinking about what it means to be a male - and I realized, that I think the first thread I made on this forum was about whether or not males have it worse off than females (easy now people... easy...) when it comes to fulfilling our gender role.

I wonder this because when it come to issues like depression or shyness, it seems to me at least, that it is more of a weakness than if it were to a female, and I come to this conclusion based on societies gender roles for males.

I am not saying these are rules, I know its a generalization - but the fact remains that there is some truth. Men are expected to be strong, to provide and to protect... to be bold and in control.... to be competitive...all the while still being emotionally available to those who need them.

We are even expected to make the first move when it comes to dating (and do you have any idea how completely and utterly terrifying that is?)

Even I find it a little distasteful if I see a guy who is being a complete pussy over something - but then I stand back and wonder...why...? Why do I think that this guy is weak...? Is it because I have been conditioned to believe men should play a particular role?

I think people are a little more forgiving to females than they are males. I have always had a problem with being shy - and I see it as the epitome (from a male gender role perspective) of weakness as viewed by the rest of society.

Also - I have been pursuing a dating forum (not a dating site... I gave up on that avenue of pleasure sometime ago...but I digress) and even there I see the kind of traits that women tend to find attractive.... Tall, strong, financially stable, independent, physically attractive, confident, dominant, powerful.

It all tells me that men have a specific role to fulfill - a difficult one. It tells me that people are not as forgiving and as kind to males who do not fit these kinds of traits.

Even when I am with guys - they all talk it up, its a constant game of one upmanship - illustrating these aforementioned attributes.

*Like I said - I know these are generalizations and not rules - but there has to be truth in it - generally speaking. What constitutes as failure being a man..? Poor, physically weak - unemployed.....unattractive...?

What about kindness, tolerance and sincerity...?

 

[Entangled]

Everyone is conditioned into gender roles since day they were born, there is no way to avoid it. I personally think gender roles and expectations are stupid (for where I live that is). It is the culture that you are living in that develops them, and then you as an individual has to choose weather or not to believe in them or continue to enforce them. A warning though, if you go against your cultural expectations a majority people will look at you differently, but you will feel much better and happier about yourself.

I struggled with this concept for a bit, but once I 'let go' of my cultures expectations of me (female), I felt a lot better about myself.

 

[Kiwong]

I have very few of those expectations of myself.

I think being strong can mean being honest about a weakness. Men are encouraged now to talk more about their problems such as mental illness. Those that do speak out are viewed as being positive as leading the way to breaking down stereotypes and stigmas.

If you seek out the right people they can be very forgiving regardless of your gender. That is my experience anyway. When I spoke out about my mental illness I got a lot of support, people saw me as more human, not weaker.

It only matters what I think about being a failure, not the opinion of anyone else.

 

[Boby]

Some say it's the culture that develops those expectations but I say this is half true ,another important factor is the animal inside us,attraction for both male and females is still heavly dependent on instinct.We want to believe that we are some kind of superior beings but the truth is we are still animals.
So it will take probably more thousands years before traits like kindness,tolerance and sincerity will become attractive.

 

[MikeyC]

I wonder this because when it come to issues like depression or shyness, it seems to me at least, that it is more of a weakness than if it were to a female, and I come to this conclusion based on societies gender roles for males.

It's just how society has molded males. It's unfortunate but that's how it is.

It all tells me that men have a specific role to fulfill - a difficult one. It tells me that people are not as forgiving and as kind to males who do not fit these kinds of traits.

Women have their own traits to fulfill, too. Most of theirs is due to appearance, but if a girl is too outspoken, that's not seen as a desirable trait. While I'm not denying men have a tough time with stereotypes, women have it just as bad.

Even when I am with guys - they all talk it up, its a constant game of one upmanship - illustrating these aforementioned attributes.

Yeah, I hate this "alpha-male" nonsense, but unfortunately it exists.

 

[bcsr]

I eat lumber, and only wear flannel. I once knocked out a charging rhino with one punch. I'm so manly, that even my voice has a beard.

But seriously, I have a hard time showing emotion in real life. That's just part of how I was raised here in the South. My dad is a great father, but he doesn't show emotion.

I don't buy into the "Alpha Male" nonsense. I'm more of a "Speak softly and carry a big stick" kind of guy. I'm very friendly, but I'm also very protective of people around me.

 

[bleach]

I have been doing some thinking about what it means to be a male - and I realized, that I think the first thread I made on this forum was about whether or not males have it worse off than females (easy now people... easy...) when it comes to fulfilling our gender role.

I wonder this because when it come to issues like depression or shyness, it seems to me at least, that it is more of a weakness than if it were to a female, and I come to this conclusion based on societies gender roles for males.

I am not saying these are rules, I know its a generalization - but the fact remains that there is some truth. Men are expected to be strong, to provide and to protect... to be bold and in control.... to be competitive...all the while still being emotionally available to those who need them.

We are even expected to make the first move when it comes to dating (and do you have any idea how completely and utterly terrifying that is?)

Even I find it a little distasteful if I see a guy who is being a complete pussy over something - but then I stand back and wonder...why...? Why do I think that this guy is weak...? Is it because I have been conditioned to believe men should play a particular role?

I think people are a little more forgiving to females than they are males. I have always had a problem with being shy - and I see it as the epitome (from a male gender role perspective) of weakness as viewed by the rest of society.

Also - I have been pursuing a dating forum (not a dating site... I gave up on that avenue of pleasure sometime ago...but I digress) and even there I see the kind of traits that women tend to find attractive.... Tall, strong, financially stable, independent, physically attractive, confident, dominant, powerful.

It all tells me that men have a specific role to fulfill - a difficult one. It tells me that people are not as forgiving and as kind to males who do not fit these kinds of traits.

Even when I am with guys - they all talk it up, its a constant game of one upmanship - illustrating these aforementioned attributes.

*Like I said - I know these are generalizations and not rules - but there has to be truth in it - generally speaking. What constitutes as failure being a man..? Poor, physically weak - unemployed.....unattractive...?

What about kindness, tolerance and sincerity...?

those are good qualiities for making friends but not much else. if nothing about your actions or character stirs the primal needs in a woman will never care more about you.

 

[MikeyC]

I'm so manly, that even my voice has a beard.

I bet it sounds like Morgan Freeman, right?

 

[Lea]

I would say regardless if you´re a man or a woman, just be yourself. It´s the only thing we can do anway, so it´s useless to envy the opposite sex. I could often say that the men have it easier, for example if they travel alone, but I can´t be a man so I have to deal with what I have. I could also say that men have it easier because they tend to be less emotional or sensitive so that they have room for more useful things instead ::. Etc. I don´t regret being a woman, I would just very much like to be a better woman .

As for doing the first move, I read somewhere that it´s women who have it more difficult, because they have to initiate it with giving out nonverbal cues. Which I have no idea about as I guess I am quite backwards in this area, but can be true. Anyway I do just things which come to me naturally so I would never attempt things which are not natural to me, like artificial dating attepts for example. But if someone naturally interests me, I talk to them, maybe even initiate it and don´t care if I am a woman.

 

[bleach]

It's just how society has molded males. It's unfortunate but that's how it is.


Women have their own traits to fulfill, too. Most of theirs is due to appearance, but if a girl is too outspoken, that's not seen as a desirable trait. While I'm not denying men have a tough time with stereotypes, women have it just as bad.

wrong, women have no behavior requirements anymore because that would be sexist. outspoken women are constantly in relationships, you must be very sheltered if you have not noticed that. women are now allowed to have a solid career but it is seen as just a perk, its certainly not a must like it is for a man. they stil have to be physical attractive but that is by far the easiest requirement to meet.

 

[bleach]

Is this your opinion or a fact?

its a fact but I cant prove it, although it should be obvious to anyone who doesnt live in a bubble

 

[Rembrandt Broam]

It's true that society does have certain expectations for men (it has expectations for women too) and each of us has to decide whether we're going to strive to fit within those expectations, or be comfortable with just being ourselves. I think there's more pressure when we're younger to conform to what we think society wants us to be. As you get older, you start to realise that a lot of that stuff doesn't really matter, and much of it is based around stereotypes anyway.

 

[Flowers-Of-Bloom]

Here is what makes a man: genitalia, regardless of size and of course the XY chromosomes. Gender (not sex) is a social construct influenced by the psychological and physiological changes produced by the human reproductive organs. Not only that but it is something that is ingrained in us from the very beginning before the hormones even begin to take over. But mostly it is society that dictates what we should like, how we should look, dress and behave and what traits are considered desirable/undesirable. Hormones, religion, stereotypes and society are all to blame for the intangible human social constructs of femininity and masculinity.

they stil have to be physical attractive but that is by far the easiest requirement to meet.

I disagree because it is not easy, especially when a woman's worth is determined by her appearance, which it so often is. Men can get away with being unattractive and still be respected for things such as intellect and talent, but a woman must be attractive first and foremost before any of her other, more important traits are even recognized. Moreover, attractiveness is mostly genetic and therefore unchangeable unless thousands of dollars are spent on potentially disastrous cosmetic surgery. Weight is another issue. There is a lot of pressure on women to look perfect, which of course is unachievable and I would not consider it a better (or worse) alternative to the expectations which are placed on men.

 

[bleach]

Here is what makes a man: genitalia, regardless of size and of course the XY chromosomes. Gender (not sex) is a social construct influenced by the psychological and physiological changes produced by the human reproductive organs. Not only that but it is something that is ingrained in us from the very beginning before the hormones even begin to take over. But mostly it is society that dictates what we should like, how we should look, dress and behave and what traits are considered desirable/undesirable. Hormones, religion, stereotypes and society are all to blame for the intangible human social constructs of femininity and masculinity.



I disagree because it is not easy, especially when a woman's worth is determined by her appearance, which it so often is. Men can get away with being unattractive and still be respected for things such as intellect and talent, but a woman must be attractive first and foremost before any of her other, more important traits are even recognized. Moreover, attractiveness is mostly genetic and therefore unchangeable unless thousands of dollars are spent on potentially disastrous cosmetic surgery. Weight is another issue. There is a lot of pressure on women to look perfect, which of course is unachievable and I would not consider it a better (or worse) alternative to the expectations which are placed on men.

men dont care if women look perfect, the pressure you talk about is mainly from other women being catty. why dont you look around at the women who are in relationships, they are all types. I have a couple friends who even prefer girls who are overweight. guys are easy to please.

 

[Mokkat]

having to live up to the cultural image of a real man (or woman), is one thing. That image being crap is another.

 

[AGR]

Worst stereoptype about men is that we are supposed to want to have sex with everyone,we can not turn down sex,if you are not like this you better lie about it,I am gratefull that I found some nice people who understand me and dont judge me much about this,but even then they think I do stuff but I hide it because I am shy,a man can never be saving themselves for the right girl, it is not acceptable.
Another sterotype that I hate is that we always have to be dominant and in control.

 

[Invisibleman]

I just wish more women understood what its like to be a man. Id be a millionaire if I had a dollar for everytime I heard a women complain about how "easy" men have it.

 

[MentalyBlind]

I still think both men and women have a lot of stuff going on no more and no less than the other. also our upbringing leads to issues that we have to deal with. like for instance My father, a workaholic and all around "mood swing-o-matic" that messes with your head after a while. yell and Beat a kid enough and the kid will start thinking that he or she did something wrong. thats why we have so much **** piled on our shoulders, It's because of OUR PARENTS! or who ever took care of us.

 

[MentalyBlind]

I think what should be fairly obvious to anyone is that both genders have their own difficulties which descend from the gender roles which society has created and people have then confounded with biased generalisations.

I agree with twiggle

 

[Flowers-Of-Bloom]

men dont care if women look perfect, the pressure you talk about is mainly from other women being catty. why dont you look around at the women who are in relationships, they are all types. I have a couple friends who even prefer girls who are overweight. guys are easy to please.

This is contrary to my experience. But everyone is different and some are more shallow than others. Still you cannot deny that there is pressure placed on women and their appearance, particularly in the media. Whether or not this pressure comes from men is irrelevant.

I just wish more women understood what its like to be a man. Id be a millionaire if I had a dollar for everytime I heard a women complain about how "easy" men have it.

Same here, except opposite genders. I think we just need to accept the fact that we don't know what the other sex goes through and leave it at that. The grass is always greener on the other side, but the truth is that it sucks to be either male or female. It sucks to be human. Sometimes I wish I was an animal... like a dolphin... or a cat. No wait, a bird, because I've always wanted to fly. Anyway, getting a bit off topic now...