Social anxiety is worst for guys who have a strong liking for girls

[Moses199]

Note: The title for my thread should be "Having strong liking for girls makes my SA worse"
I dont know how but i mistakenly wrote the title of this thread to say SA is "worst" for male gender because of high intimacy drive. That's not what i was trying to say and it's my fault for not knowing the difference between "worst" and "worse" lol. A little bit of some googling cleared that for me lol. Sorry, i'm not the smartest when it comes to literacy, but i'm getting better in a considerable rate ;-) . I was never the type to listen at school , but reaching adult hood i started being more intrested in education. I'm 22yrs old.

I dont want to sound like a perv or a "woman" objectifier, but having a strong affection and liking for women will make SA worst. I see many guys in this forum that don't seem to obsessed or have strong desire for woman like me, rather they have a mild case of it. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. It's actually good because you won't stress yourself out or feel like sh*t that you can't have what you want most.

Not sound like pervert, but i would say i have very huge affinity for attractive girls that alot of times i browser facebook and imagine myself being with them. Or when i'm in public i like to spot out the cute girls and image myself being with them. Most nights in my bed i imagine a attractive girl i see alot or i know beside me and cuddling with me like she is my girl. I love seduction so much that i watch alot of PUA infield videos just for enjoyment (none sexual), and not for educational purposes. I dont know what it is, but i love watching other guys pick up girls, i guess it's a vicarious thing that makes me feel good that i can do the same as them.

I truly believe if i didn't have SA i would be a player and would not stick to one relationship because my passion would get the best of me. But i know this detrimental and will cause serious problems in the long run. I believe i'm naturally good with woman and that if i didn't have SA it would have no problem getting them. I believe any man is capable of attaining the girl he wants, it's just a matter of if you want it or not. I would say if 80% of the reason why i want to overcame SA is to be with girls. Sometimes i feel like if my desire for girls was to completely diminished then i wouldn't care about getting rid of my SA and i could live life in seclusion with this crap.

But i believe all this comes with a cost, which is madness for me. Almost everday i feel depressed when i see a hot girl and the thought that if i didn't have SA i could easily be with her, which kills me and makes me feel like i'm going to have a painful life. I believe the only way to get rid of this, is to stop myself of these thought patterns and compulsions. However, i feel like i would be giving up something i'm truly desire and passion.

 

[PugofCrydee]

"I see many guys in this forum that don't seem to obsessed or have strong desire for woman like me, rather they have a mild case of it."

That's a pretty strong assumption about people you've never met.
I certainly don't believe SA is worse for one gender, it's an individual thing, not gender.

 

[Moses199]

"I see many guys in this forum that don't seem to obsessed or have strong desire for woman like me, rather they have a mild case of it."

That's a pretty strong assumption about people you've never met.
I certainly don't believe SA is worse for one gender, it's an individual thing, not gender.

I didn't say all guys are like that. I said "many" of them.
And by "worst" i mean aspects that make it worst for men or women. Like i would say SA can be worst for women because they have to put up with guys watching them sexually when they walk in public. I see this alot and makes me glad i'm a male sometimes. But SA can be worst for any gender, just depends on the severity of some aspects.

 

[Kiwong]

I reckon social anxiety is worse for those who suffer so much fear of people and life in general that they struggle to get out of the door and face the world. That simple things like talking to another person, speaking on the phone, are terrifying, just every minute of everyday is like a worst nightmare coming true.

 

[Bronson99]

I believe any man is capable of attaining the girl he wants, it's just a matter of if you want it or not. I would say if 80% of the reason why i want to overcame SA is to be with girls.

If this is the case for you, then the answer is one of 2 things:

1) Work on diminishing your social anxiety, through various methodologies (learn to like yourself, try some social exposure tactics, etc.)

2) Suppress your desire for women, which spares you the pain of not having what you want.. but then leaves with you SA which you no longer have impetus to fight

It's one or the other. Which will you choose?

 

[Remus]

I see many guys in this forum that don't seem to obsessed or have strong desire for woman like me, rather they have a mild case of it.

Yeah pretty much like that with me. I'm demi/asexual though and on the other end of the spectrum to yourself. If you are at the other extreme, I can see how you would perceive that about guys with just normal sex drives/attractions.

 

[sphenisciformes]

Anxiety regarding interaction with the sex/gender you're attracted to is just one facet of SA. I don't think you can pinpoint one aspect of SA and say 'this is the worst one, if you don't suffer from it you have it much easier than I do'.

 

[SCP-087-1]

Exposure therapy, bro. Talk to women a lot and it will diminish the fear over time. Get rejected a lot and you wont dread it so much. Start out small like saying "Good morning/afternoon" to some random chick passing you on the street. Try to smile while doing it. Slowly work your way up from that.

That PUA stuff doesn't work unless you're charismatic and can think quickly in a conversation because people rarely follow the script you came up with in your head. But talking to people often will cause you to slowly develop people skills and charisma

Exposure therapy is a long process and can be scary as hell. At times it will seem like you are making no progress and you'll wanna give up but if you stick with it you should see results. At least do some research on it. Just google "Exposure therapy for anxiety".
It's also helpful to learn some breathing exercises or some other method to be able to calm yourself when it all seems so over whelming.

I did some exposure therapy and had some success. I can now make phone calls. I couldn't do that before without freaking out. I also joined some local clubs that I've been interested in for a while. I should really start actively doing exposure therapy again. I try to incorporate it in my day to day life a little, like i try having a conversation with cashiers and stuff, but I should actively start doing it again.

 

[BlackPuma]

I reckon social anxiety is worse for those who suffer so much fear of people and life in general that they struggle to get out of the door and face the world. That simple things like talking to another person, speaking on the phone, are terrifying, just every minute of everyday is like a worst nightmare coming true.

I'm going to have to agree with this. I am far from being asexual with an above normal drive, but if my social problems were to be of a erotic/sensual nature exclusively, I'd live the rest of my life as a happy person in comparison.

To have a job and it not be torture, to make a phone call and not compulsively wanting to throw it against a wall, and to be around people and not be aware of every muscle.. man, I'd give the world for that.

Social anxiety is most difficult for everyone that tries to achieve a goal or lifestyle but isn't able to due to said anxiety. And with that I don't mean to demean OP's struggles, but more that I don't agree that it's harder for one than the other based on what ambitions you have, but rather based on severity of the condition.

 

[darrens]

I think its crazy and wrong to believe there is a lot of straight guys out there who naturally don't have a strong feelings towards girls.What i do think can happen is a lot of times guys can get depressed which will affect sex drive if something seems impossible to attain it won't be a realistic hope so it can lead to asexual type of feelings but i didn't do research or anything but i would be pretty sure it would be hard to find an asexual straight guy its just depressed/hopelessness phases can lead to feelings like that.

 

[Moses199]

Anxiety regarding interaction with the sex/gender you're attracted to is just one facet of SA. I don't think you can pinpoint one aspect of SA and say 'this is the worst one, if you don't suffer from it you have it much easier than I do'.

I clearly clarified on my last post that by "worst" i dont mean it's the severest from all other's. I said by "worst" it makes SA severer. If i meant "worst" as in more severer than anybody than i would completely contradict myself. Because i know there are people who have SA 10x worse than me and are asexual.

 

[Moses199]

I think its crazy and wrong to believe there is a lot of straight guys out there who naturally don't have a strong feelings towards girls..

Yes you are correct. But there is small majority of SA suffers that have it EXTREME like me. Which is the case for me. I have in the EXTREME side of the spectrum of high a drive, meaning everyday i think about girls and fantasize of them. Like i said in my OP, i spend alot of time watching PUA infield videos for pure vicarious enjoyment, and totally disregard the educational side of it. I watch them just to imagine myself doing the same. There also ridiculous amount of other things i do to do fantasize being with women (non sexually). Majoirty of people with SA arn't the extreme level of this . And again, there is nothing wrong with that, i'm just saying what's severe for me. i'm sure other people have other aspects of SA that's severer than mine.

So my point is there is NOT alot people with SA that are in the HIGH-EXTREME side of the spectrum for desire and affection of women. Most are in the middle or lower. Or else i would be seeing many threads about the same issues as me, which i find very little of.

What i do think can happen is a lot of times guys can get depressed which will affect sex drive if something seems impossible to attain it won't be a realistic hope so it can lead to asexual type of feelings but i didn't do research or anything but i would be pretty sure it would be hard to find an asexual straight guy its just depressed/hopelessness phases can lead to feelings like that.

I havn't did research too, but i believe for extreme driven SA people with high intimacy drives it never goes down for them. Unless you start trying to forget about it, which is hard for me because it's sooo addictive and compulsive. I feel like i would be painfully giving up something that can bring me so much joy and happiness if i attain it. But if it's going to drive me madness, then it's not worth it.

 

[Odo]

PUA guys don't have affection for women.

They definitely have desire, but it has nothing to do with the women they're pursuing and everything to do with their own egos and how they define their value as a person (sleeping with lots of women means they're a 'real' man). They need women to love, respect and admire them without ever offering the same in return, and take pride in manipulating women (or at least thinking they're manipulating women) into behaving how they want them to behave. They also tend to be hypocrites who are put off by women who behave the way they do.

I'm sure it's not exactly fun to have issues with women but it's hard to feel sorry for someone whose main goal in life is to sleep around/seduce women all the time (and I get that it's not just about having sex-- the women also have to be irresistibly charmed by your greatness and probably be in love with you even though you don't have to love them back... oh, and they have to be 'hot').

Lots of people don't pick up women all the time and have really great lives-- the difference is they can be happy to find one person and build a genuine, mutually beneficial commitment out of it... but apparently this isn't enough for you.

So no, I really don't think SA is worst for guys who have a strong 'liking' for girls, since actually liking someone is never really the point with these guys. It's still sad, but not in a way that evokes any sympathy... and it's definitely not on the level of someone who has the potential/desire to become a cancer scientist, but instead works in retail because of anxiety. I wouldn't even put it on the level of unrequited love, and I think it would also finish lower than someone who wishes they could muster up the nerve to go to the bathroom in a public place.

In fact it would probably finish very close to last place in any pity contest I was judging.

 

[AlienGeranium]

I'm not sure if there's a term for it, but in the past I remember I had a very big fantasy/reality divide, meaning there was my daydreaming fantasy side of my mind which felt very far away, and my reality side which is how I believed I would act and is in fact how I did.

The secret is though, that they don't have to be separate. "Dreams can come true" if you will. If you believe that you CAN attain the fantasies in your head, then with some work you can. I don't know know where you are on the anxiety scale, but just taking steps to get to the point you want to get to is key. For me, the internet was a huge tool.

First I used a forum to express myself and act in a way I wish I could IRL, and interact with users as I wished I could with people I met on the street. Then I realized they were people, and they didn't think me pathetic. I went from posts to chats, talking to people in real time in a groups. Then one on one convos. Then video chats with no sound (Mutism was an issue for me). Then voice chats. Then I physical met some people, and interacted just as my fantasy persona from the forum would. Except it wasn't fake, it was really me. And yeah, it was a long process, but the progress I made was amazing. At one point it was a real struggle to get even a sentence out to a girl, even ones I knew well, and I've now had multiple girlfriends. I had to have hope though, and a belief that I could be the person I wanted to be.

I think you can too.

 

[sphenisciformes]

I clearly clarified on my last post that by "worst" i dont mean it's the severest from all other's. I said by "worst" it makes SA severer. If i meant "worst" as in more severer than anybody than i would completely contradict myself. Because i know there are people who have SA 10x worse than me and are asexual.

I think you're meaning to say 'worse' instead of 'worst'. Worst is the least good of all, worse is lesser in comparison to a varying degree.

 

[Bronson99]

I'm sure it's not exactly fun to have issues with women but it's hard to feel sorry for someone whose main goal in life is to sleep around/seduce women all the time (and I get that it's not just about having sex-- the women also have to be irresistibly charmed by your greatness and probably be in love with you even though you don't have to love them back... oh, and they have to be 'hot').

So much assumption here.. it almost seems this is bullying. Where has the OP confirmed your assumptions about him?

He has a problem with this desire but has he made it explicitly clear that he would be arrogant **** PUA guy, if he could be?

To me it seems he wants to learn ways to mirror the charms of a charismatic man popular with women, but nowhere has he said he ONLY wants to use women as his own toys, discard them, and go to the next.

To me he appears to be having unusual difficulty with his (as he says) high natural desire.

 

[Odo]

So much assumption here.. it almost seems this is bullying. Where has the OP confirmed your assumptions about him?

He has a problem with this desire but has he made it explicitly clear that he would be arrogant **** PUA guy, if he could be?

To me it seems he wants to learn ways to mirror the charms of a charismatic man popular with women, but nowhere has he said he ONLY wants to use women as his own toys, discard them, and go to the next.

To me he appears to be having unusual difficulty with his (as he says) high natural desire.

It was in his last comment before he edited it... but I don't know how you can look at what he hasn't edited out and come to any other conclusion. It seems pretty naive to assume he has an 'above normal amount of desire' (as if this can even be measured), watches cute girls and imagines himself with them/waking up beside them, watches PUA videos where dodgy guys are taking home girls they just met... and yet really only longs to meet that special someone, fall in love and do whatever he can to make sure the relationship works long term.

That said, I don't think marriage/relationships are inherently better than sleeping around or even make a lot of sense in this society. It's not like modern women are delicate flowers who aren't responsible for their own actions (unless of course they're young and naive)... so most of the using isn't a one-way street. People need to feel attractive, they want recreational pleasure and narcissism is epidemic... so it's not really surprising that someone is upset that they're not part of the sexual free-for-all... but the idea of it being a terrible tragedy that someone isn't getting laid all the time (or even that they aren't getting female attention all the time) is absurd.

Most men do not get to be the center of female attention wherever they go, so it's really hard for me (and I suspect most people) to support the conclusion that he's worse off than anyone else with SA. It actually demeans other people's struggles to proclaiming himself to be the biggest SA victim in the world.

To be honest, when someone complains about something like this, I am tempted to even call into question whether they have SA or not. It's like there's this weird expectation that all guys are supposed to be having lots of sex and approaching lots of women, and if you're not comfortable with doing that then you MUST have a psychological issue. Maybe the issue is that men are being taught by society that being a man**** is some sort of notable achievement and it's screwing with their heads?

Is it really bullying to express this opinion? I guess I am being pretty blunt and I could have focused more on how he feels about it instead of trying to pick his statements apart, but if he didn't want this type of reaction then he shouldn't have invited everyone to compare his situation with other people's situations. I know we're a support site here but I don't think we're obligated to blindly agree with what everyone says.

 

[Ignopius]

I think SA is about equal for both genders. However, I do think in terms of dating men are at an incredible disadvantage. Men are expected to take charge and initiate (especially in the early stages) and women can usually get by and find a mate with minimal effort.

 

[Deus_Ex_Lemur]

There's strong opinion's Odo, and there's out right attacking someone and claiming if that person has SA or not is not constructive. Having SA doesn't negate the type of persons someone is or how they'd treat women or other men or any human being. That's separate from the issue.

Now I have issue with what Moses says, but I also get what he tried to clarify.

I think SA is about equal for both genders. However, I do think in terms of dating men are at an incredible disadvantage. Men are expected to take charge and initiate (especially in the early stages) and women can usually get by and find a mate with minimal effort.

This. I mean my owns observation - with uncollected data - but from these forums to others, to RL SA groups - I've seen more women who've had or have boyfriends vs. men who never have of similar age. Now - that DOES NOT MEAN to generalize most women with SA end up getting boyfriends or don't struggle as much with "love". But societal structure dictates guys to initiate over the girl. Girls are girls, guys without SA will approach girls more than reverse just a fact. SA probably will prevent much from happening from there.

That again, DOES NOT MEAN I'M SAYING it's WORSE FOR GUYS... or that plenty of girls here or anywhere have never had a BF or relationship or happy in one. SA hinders. Girls have a different specific struggle and guys can have theirs base on social groups. At the end of the day most end up in same spot under different circumstances. Aka a girl may struggle from BEING asked/approached, a guy struggles BY approaching - either way - interacting for BOTH is the same struggle.

SO - other's have said - if you really WANT to interact more with women (I'll just leave it at that not go into PUA) yes, small steps, exposure therapy only way. I mean - ultimate way. I still struggle depending on the situation, esp when I've had social setbacks. But do what you'd normally avoid. Small ways.

Ex: Girl at coffee shop across from you. Smile vs. avoiding eye contact.
Next time similar situation - Smile, maybe say hi with smile. Doesn't need to lead to more. Maybe there's a plug by her that can be "an in" for a simple interaction. That's how I started. Be open to anything to happen. But doing ANYTHING is better than just doing NOTHING.

One failure for me personally and I've noticed is ppl putting too much pressure on themselves or trying to build Rome in a day. Or whatever.

 

[Bronson99]

It seems pretty naive to assume he has an 'above normal amount of desire' (as if this can even be measured), watches cute girls and imagines himself with them/waking up beside them, watches PUA videos where dodgy guys are taking home girls they just met... and yet really only longs to meet that special someone, fall in love and do whatever he can to make sure the relationship works long term.

I guess my point was, pretty much, let's not react in such a moralistic way if he's simply not interested in serious relationships right now (or, possibly, for the foreseeable future.) In fact you yourself even go on to explain that you wouldn't judge a man for being more interested in the short-term side of things.

Most men do not get to be the center of female attention wherever they go, so it's really hard for me (and I suspect most people) to support the conclusion that he's worse off than anyone else with SA. It actually demeans other people's struggles to proclaiming himself to be the biggest SA victim in the world.

On this I can agree, and I wish he had left out the "comparison" thing altogether. In which case we are still left with a man plagued by desire he feels he cannot do anything about because of the difficulty imposed by SA. As I said before, though, this shouldn't need to be so taboo. Look at it this way, if he said he was mad that his SA was preventing him from doing anything besides "hooking-up," or whatever, no one would have raised their sabre.

To be honest, when someone complains about something like this, I am tempted to even call into question whether they have SA or not.

Actually, I'm more likely to call SA into question when someone *is* actually very charming and charismatic with women...