I don't know whether she likes me or not...

[doubleM]

^Hmm? I disagree with you. I don't understand this whole thing about her being manipulative or using him because she doesn't give in easily. Even if he has to wait 4 years to end up with her, she is in no way a mean or manipulative person. She seems to like him. All that the OP described in this thread appear to me just like normal reactions of an unsure human being.

its possible since we dont really know the people involved. but let me tell you what happened to me.
i fell in love with this girl in senior year of high school. i could not bring myself to tell her. my every moment was spent trying to keep hope alive that she might like me back. we would often hang out as friends, though sometimes it seemed she would avoid me. i was very similar to the OP. i waited and waited. eventually i worked up the courage and told her straight out how i felt, that i liked her. though i held some things back. she said she didnt really want a bf at that time, so i figured i could bring it up later. i waited. 2 months later she ran off and married some other guy. that was the worst hurt i had ever endured in my life. life went on, but i still thought of her everyday.
anyway about 6 years later i wrote her a letter just to see how she was doing. we talked on the phone, yahoo, email...catching up. it turns out her ex had just left her...abandoned her and their son. she was heartbroken over him. what timing....
then we met up and had dinner one night. im sitting there looking at her in that moment, listening to her talk....i had not seen her in what felt like a lifetime. this is someone i thought i would never see again, and here she was right in front of me. im listening to her every word, but all she can talk about is someone who does not love her, who used her, and abandoned her. and here i am i would do anything for her. i wanted to talk to her about my feelings again, but i chose not to. it wouldnt have mattered. then she walked out of my life again without so much as a goodbye.
i was just a shoulder to cry on. but the point is she did this not because she was a manipulative or mean person. it was because its her nature. women want men who offer them security and who will go straight for what they want. women do not want men who will wait for them forever. it had become obvious to me i meant nothing to her, i did not qualify as boyfriend material...i never did.
if you want something you have to go get it. dont dance around it, just do it. OP, you should go find her and just spit it out. tell her you must know now. you cant go through life wishing you had things and not doing anything about it. but prepare yourself for rejection. if she doesnt want you, let it go once and for all. there are plenty of fish.
believe me i know youre afraid, but you must face the problem. i do not regret telling her how i felt. im glad i did it, even though she does not want me.

 

[Haruhiist]

have you ever seen the movie "Million Dollar Baby"? well theres this scene where hilary swank tells clint eastwood, "im workin the bag, boss!". clint then says, "no youre not. that bag is workin you." that is what is happening to you. when people are emotional they are more easily manipulated. she is playing on your emotions, keeping you for when she needs you. you are an option.
trust me ive been where you are. it seems you have feelings for her and you cannot accept that she does not return them. you have already spent time and money on her. just let it go. you can keep your hopes alive....she may initiate a relationship of convenience with you, but if she does not return your feelings, it wont last. you are still an option to her.

Hoho, like I said, I'm not like that, and neither is she.
I hate it to be clingy and I don't chase people, she usually makes the move. I hate it to be submissive to someone, so I don't think I'm the back-up type. She's also not the girl who would come to people when she's in trouble in the first place.

She's not manipulating me at all, and trust me, I would know if someone is. Like I said, I hate to be used by people, and I tend to ignore them and show displeasure when that happens.

The problem with the guys you are mentioning is, they never do stuff they prefer themselves, and that's why it turns women off. It's not like I always say yes to whatever she does, when she does stuff that disrespects me, I ignore her, or I get a little pissed off and we talk about it. That's the major difference I guess.

In fact, I could learn a thing or two of people who gets used by girls... They at least do an effort to make the girl happy.

I also read your second post, and my situation is nothing like yours. It's too bad to hear it. But like I said, I'm not someone to dwell on just 1 girl. If she rejects me flatout, I would have this "**** you" attitude. Yes, I'm afraid of rejection, but I'm pretty sure I can give up on her pretty fast. And I also don't like women like that, who plays around with people's feelings, when she doesn't like someone, she really say it in front of their faces. I've seen it before. A lot of guys try to flirt with her, but she's always honest and really tell what she's thinking.

Are you needy and clingy? Combine that with your neuroticism and aloofness/moodiness, and that's probably why this girl changed her mind about you. I'm sure she really liked you initially, but those are all really unattractive, off-putting qualities.

Women like confidence in their men. I'm not saying you need to have a Type-A personality; that's not what I'm saying at all. But you need to at least have the confidence to be straight-forward about your feelings, especially when the other person is practically inviting you to reciprocate. It's natural to want to play it safe in the beginning stages of getting to know someone, but at some point everyday you continue to dance around the perimeter is another day the window closes just a bit more. And it may not even have to do with her being tired/resentful of putting herself out there for you, but meekness, passivity and constantly playing things safe are just really unattractive. lol.

To me, it's no mystery why she changed her mind. But hopefully this playing games at her house thing means you're being given another chance. Good luck.

I understand what your point is, and that's also something I'm worrying about. I notice the look on her face when I act awkward. But it hasn't always been like that. We've been on good terms for a "long" time. It's only until recently (2 months) that we're kind of awkward.

Yesterday, she apologized for her behavior, that she has this mental disease that makes her moody. She said that she understands that it's neither her fault or mine, but that it's just some that occurs. She also stated that this does not damage our friendship, because she's well-aware of her behavior.

Still, I don't doubt that your scenario might be true... But I'm kind of contemplating about the possibilities. Also, some events I mentioned happened after the post you quoted.

 

[Mokkat]

Sounds real simple for you, since you are already close to this girl without being friendzone material (in theory, I have no practical experience with girls whatsoever).
All you gotta do is to tell it to her straight that you want to be with her - slowly and awkwardly but it should be possible. She will probably be upset and start questioning you cause of the shakeup of routines, but if she is really interested and you give her time to consider, she should be able to give you a straight answer back

 

[doubleM]

Hoho, like I said, I'm not like that, and neither is she.
I hate it to be clingy and I don't chase people, she usually makes the move. I hate it to be submissive to someone, so I don't think I'm the back-up type. She's also not the girl who would come to people when she's in trouble in the first place.

She's not manipulating me at all, and trust me, I would know if someone is. Like I said, I hate to be used by people, and I tend to ignore them and show displeasure when that happens.

The problem with the guys you are mentioning is, they never do stuff they prefer themselves, and that's why it turns women off. It's not like I always say yes to whatever she does, when she does stuff that disrespects me, I ignore her, or I get a little pissed off and we talk about it. That's the major difference I guess.

In fact, I could learn a thing or two of people who gets used by girls... They at least do an effort to make the girl happy.

I also read your second post, and my situation is nothing like yours. It's too bad to hear it. But like I said, I'm not someone to dwell on just 1 girl. If she rejects me flatout, I would have this "**** you" attitude. Yes, I'm afraid of rejection, but I'm pretty sure I can give up on her pretty fast. And I also don't like women like that, who plays around with people's feelings, when she doesn't like someone, she really say it in front of their faces. I've seen it before. A lot of guys try to flirt with her, but she's always honest and really tell what she's thinking.

no need to get all offended. maybe that was a tad harsh for me to think she was manipulating you. being that i dont know you or her. but from what i gather it sounded very similar to my situation. sry if i offended you with my analogy. that is just how some women treat nice guys. BUT, this girl does have you....whether she knows it or not, that tips the scales in her favor.
in my opinion if a girl is truly honest, and she knows a guy likes her, and the guy comes to her with his feelings, then she should give a straight answer. not play games. i dont think you understand that, and you are making it more complicated than it should be. and on the contrary, your situation is very much like mine was.

I'm not someone to dwell on just 1 girl.... I'm pretty sure I can give up on her pretty fast

if thats true then why are you doing this to yourself. this will cause you to feel miserable eventually. again you should spit it out and get a straight up answer. then go from there.

 

[Haruhiist]

To show you guys that I'm not planning to give up, and I don't always have bad news to report.

The girl brought up a topic about lending me her notes, because I've got an upcoming examination. So I went to her house, and she asked me if I want to dine with her. Not a lot happened, but it was like the old times, we laughed, talked a lot, and had fun.

At the end, when we said goodbye, she even asked me if I had things to do later these days. It's a small development, but I'm really happy about it!