Does God exist?

[lunarla]

Both religions and spirituality are coping mechanisms. That's how I've come to think of it. Sometimes I find myself wondering about afterlife and drawing up conclusions that seem neat to me, but I can distinguish that as myself trying to cope with reality and all these questions. I suppose that science's conclusion (and fact) of evolution may seem very mundane to many. I see it as empowering and amazing though. I am not living my life to serve some greater being, I do not have to credit that person for what good may happen. But when all else fails, Benny Hinn is very entertaining, even though the fact that someone like he exists and that so many people actually believe in that nonsense is scary.

YouTube - Benny Hinn - FIRE Fall on Kids (1)

To any believers, what do you think of Benny Hinn and such "miracle crusaders"? As well as speaking in "tongues" and the sort? I'm very interested to know. I've spoken to some religious people who think it's just as ridiculous as I do, but then there are obviously many who believe in this.

 

[worrywort]

To any believers, what do you think of Benny Hinn and such "miracle crusaders"? As well as speaking in "tongues" and the sort? I'm very interested to know. I've spoken to some religious people who think it's just as ridiculous as I do, but then there are obviously many who believe in this.

I'm torn on the subject. 90% of my being absolutely HATES Benny Hinn with a passion and everything that he represents. This whole emotional blackmailing, miracle crusading, brainwashing culture that seems so predominant in churches nowadays. I hate it because on the surface it seems so obviously to be utter bull****! It seems like it can be explained away easily as just a phsychological phenomenon and it makes me angry that people can be so unquestioning about it all and so easily induced and hypnotised by the whole thing. It also makes me angry that this is now the image of Christianity that is being conveyed to the world, and so it's no wonder so many people turn away from the church nowadays.

and yet still, there remains within me the quiet 10% voice that reminds me that I KNOW that God exists and I know that if God wanted to deeply stir peoples hearts in profound ways he easily could. I've also heard a lot of stories of miraculous healings from very trustworthy sources and I've experienced some really unexplainable things in my own walk with God, so I guess there's a part of me that believes all these "healings" and "outpourings of the holy spirit" could easily be true, it's just that the way these churches go about it nowadays [and they're mainly American churches, I must admit] just seems like they're forcing it and staging it too much.

So I dunno, I guess my official position is that I believe that speaking in tongues, miraculous healings and outpourings of the holy spirit are real and do happen, but I think many of these modern glamorized, televised and commercialized churches have mixed it with so much bull*** and spin that it's easy to throw the baby out with the bath water and codemn the whole charade.

But who knows, I guess there's always one way to find out its validity for sure. Next time the circus is in town step up to the front yourself and see if God zaps you!

 

[lunarla]

I'm torn on the subject. 90% of my being absolutely HATES Benny Hinn with a passion and everything that he represents. This whole emotional blackmailing, miracle crusading, brainwashing culture that seems so predominant in churches nowadays. I hate it because on the surface it seems so obviously to be utter bull****! It seems like it can be explained away easily as just a phsychological phenomenon and it makes me angry that people can be so unquestioning about it all and so easily induced and hypnotised by the whole thing. It also makes me angry that this is now the image of Christianity that is being conveyed to the world, and so it's no wonder so many people turn away from the church nowadays.

and yet still, there remains within me the quiet 10% voice that reminds me that I KNOW that God exists and I know that if God wanted to deeply stir peoples hearts in profound ways he easily could. I've also heard a lot of stories of miraculous healings from very trustworthy sources and I've experienced some really unexplainable things in my own walk with God, so I guess there's a part of me that believes all these "healings" and "outpourings of the holy spirit" could easily be true, it's just that the way these churches go about it nowadays [and they're mainly American churches, I must admit] just seems like they're forcing it and staging it too much.

So I dunno, I guess my official position is that I believe that speaking in tongues, miraculous healings and outpourings of the holy spirit are real and do happen, but I think many of these modern glamorized, televised and commercialized churches have mixed it with so much bull*** and spin that it's easy to throw the baby out with the bath water and codemn the whole charade.

But who knows, I guess there's always one way to find out its validity for sure. Next time the circus is in town step up to the front yourself and see if God zaps you!

Would you mind telling of some of those "miraculous healings" and what you would say has been unexplainable?

 

[Emily_G]

To any believers, what do you think of Benny Hinn and such "miracle crusaders"? As well as speaking in "tongues" and the sort? I'm very interested to know. I've spoken to some religious people who think it's just as ridiculous as I do, but then there are obviously many who believe in this.

I don't know who Benny Hinn is, but based on what I've studied on the subject of miracles and tongues...they are not for today. Signs were for the unbelieving Jews, not for the Gentiles. Tongues occured 3 times in the Bible, all in the book of Acts. Every time there was an unbelieving Jew in the room who spoke a different langauge than the preacher, the preacher spoke in "tongues" which was the native language of the Jew in the room so he could get the message as well.

 

[lunarla]

I don't know who Benny Hinn is, but based on what I've studied on the subject of miracles and tongues...they are not for today. Signs were for the unbelieving Jews, not for the Gentiles. Tongues occured 3 times in the Bible, all in the book of Acts. Every time there was an unbelieving Jew in the room who spoke a different langauge than the preacher, the preacher spoke in "tongues" which was the native language of the Jew in the room so he could get the message as well.

Then what would you say about the people who actually claim to be speaking in tongues? It seems that they think they are good christians. Do they have it wrong? (Well, they definitely do and are just speaking jibberish in my opinion. But I'm just interested in a religious view point). A lot of these people have been brought up religious and think they have just as close of a relationship with "god" as you may think.

 

[rainstreet]

I think that Benny Hinn and most of the televangelists of his ilk are misdirected and have become overly impressed with their popularity. I cannot watch them for more that a few seconds. I'm not going to judge someone else who loves the religious carnivals. Maybe they serve a purpose but i cant see past their absurd stage behavior. One only has to think about how Jesus presented himself. None of the gospels relates situations in which he pranced around like an idiot, doing anything to draw attention to himself.

 

[rainstreet]

As far as the charismatic experience, speaking in tongues, etc..., I think that it can be overemphasized. There are those who feel that it's a part of salvation, which isn't right. These people seem to think that the "baptism of the Holy Spirit" has to involve speaking in tongues, frothing at the mouth, falling down and rolling around, etc... The Pentecost experience in Acts had a definite purpose. It signified the birth of the Christian church. I think it's purpose in modern day worship is questionable.

 

[lunarla]

rainstreet: Then you would agree from your point of view, that as it is represented today, it is essentially just jibberish and theatrics, whether of good intentions or not? And if that's the case, isn't that sacrilegious? So in that sense, shouldn't it be fellow christians that say something against the people who believe and perform in such a way?

 

[rainstreet]

I must admit that I have a definite problem with those who "perform" in God's name. These people may have begun with sincere motivations but things went awry at some point. Fame and wealth are powerful influences. Don't know how I'd behave in the same situation but that'll never happen cause I hate public speaking. maybe it's a pet peeve of mine but pomp and ceremony are not my thing. To attempt to answer your question, if we see someone who professes to be a Christian but whose actions are influencing others in the opposite way, we are supposed to tell them. The important thing here is to be very certain that your own behavior is squeaky clean. Unfortunately, I'm not there yet.

 

[worrywort]

Would you mind telling of some of those "miraculous healings" and what you would say has been unexplainable?

yea sure, although I should give this disclaimer first that these stories alone are not what I hang my faith in God upon. I have other much more airtight reasons for believing that God exists. But these stories are still very strange and make me think and I guess they help to build up a sense of something supernatural. Also summing up a story in a few sentences is very different from actually living the story out, feeling what I was feeling at the time and seeing what I was seeing at the time, so there'll probably be a LOT lost in translation. With that said, here's a few stories,

1. A couple in my church were told by their doctors that it was a medical impossibility for them to concieve a child and any further attempts to do so would be futile. Nevertheless, every couple of weeks the couple would share their stories with the church of how they believed God wanted them to keep trying for a baby because he had promised them that one day they would have a child. Several years went by until one day the couple stood at the front of the church and announced that they were pregnant! It was an incredible day! 9 months later and I saw the kid with my own eyes!

2. On holiday a couple of years ago we went to this massive adventure park where they had drop slides. My little sister had a fear of them but was determined to face her fear and go down one of these slides. Perched at the top, legs dangled over the edge, she was trying to pluck up the courage to go down but couldn't do it. I was watching her from the side so I started to say a little prayer to God in my head to help her. Suddenly she went for it and dropped down the slide and I congratulated her at the bottom. Later in the car I asked her what made her decide to go, and she said she wouldn't have done it if I hadn't pushed her down, but I told her that I didn't push her, I wasn't anywhere near her, and she said, well somebody did, cause she could feel hands gently pushing her from behind. But I was watching her the whole time and there was definitly nobody behind her.

3. At uni, I had a phase where I began questioning all religions. I wanted to find the truth and I had been praying to God to reveal which is the true religion to me. Also at the same time I was studying cyberculture. Part of my course was to make a blog and view the blogs of my classmates. Now there was a girl in my class called Sara Larabi who I had a crush on, but I didn't know her blog address. So, at home, I thought I'd just try guessing a few addresses. I tried saralarabi.blogspot.com, and saral.blogspot.com, and then I tried "slarabi.blogspot.com" and to my surprise suddenly a "MEGA-SITE of bible and christian information" popped up. When I checked the url I discovered that I had accidentily missed an 's' out and had written "slarabi.blogpot.com". When I reinserted the 's' it turns out that was also the correct address for sara's blog. It wasn't til I had really reflected on all the small coincidences that had to occur for this to have happened; my crush on sara larabi, both url's differing by just one letter, and for me to have mistyped that one letter, that it really made my head spin. Both urls are still active today if you'd like to check - slarabi.blogpot.com and slarabi.blogspot.com

I have tons of other stories I'd love to tell but I'll leave it there for now.

Now I know what most people are probably thinking, that these can all be explained away with natural explanations, and of course thats a valid possibility but I think there's something deeper and more interesting going on with supernatural stories, in particular the way different people respond to them. Almost everybody has had some kind of experience with the supernatural, whether directly or through stories of others, and we're always left with two choices. To believe or not to believe. But choosing the latter also means that you are choosing to believe something else, which is that the person making the claim is either a liar or a madman. If I chose not to believe the pregnant couple from my church I'd have to justify that choice by insinuating that they were misguided somehow. That they don't questions the facts as well as I do. That they've manipulated the truth, or any other discrediting assumption about their character. Of course sometimes this may very well be the case, people do sometimes lie and people are sometimes misguided, but given the vast number of supernatural claims across the world can I really discredit all of them? That's the question that gets me thinking!

 

[lunarla]

I must admit that I have a definite problem with those who "perform" in God's name. These people may have begun with sincere motivations but things went awry at some point. Fame and wealth are powerful influences. Don't know how I'd behave in the same situation but that'll never happen cause I hate public speaking. maybe it's a pet peeve of mine but pomp and ceremony are not my thing. To attempt to answer your question, if we see someone who professes to be a Christian but whose actions are influencing others in the opposite way, we are supposed to tell them. The important thing here is to be very certain that your own behavior is squeaky clean. Unfortunately, I'm not there yet.

Well, certainly your behaviour is far better than that of someone who is raking in the money pretending to be the word of your god. I don't see why it's necessary to be squeaky clean, as you put it. If I were religious I would be hugely offended by someone belittling the name of god. That's what really frustrates me. If there are christians out there that don't believe in all this nonsense, which I know there are, then why haven't they pushed these phonies that are out for the money off their pedestals yet?

yea sure, although I should give this disclaimer first that these stories alone are not what I hang my faith in God upon. I have other much more airtight reasons for believing that God exists. But these stories are still very strange and make me think and I guess they help to build up a sense of something supernatural. Also summing up a story in a few sentences is very different from actually living the story out, feeling what I was feeling at the time and seeing what I was seeing at the time, so there'll probably be a LOT lost in translation. With that said, here's a few stories,

1. A couple in my church were told by their doctors that it was a medical impossibility for them to concieve a child and any further attempts to do so would be futile. Nevertheless, every couple of weeks the couple would share their stories with the church of how they believed God wanted them to keep trying for a baby because he had promised them that one day they would have a child. Several years went by until one day the couple stood at the front of the church and announced that they were pregnant! It was an incredible day! 9 months later and I saw the kid with my own eyes!

2. On holiday a couple of years ago we went to this massive adventure park where they had drop slides. My little sister had a fear of them but was determined to face her fear and go down one of these slides. Perched at the top, legs dangled over the edge, she was trying to pluck up the courage to go down but couldn't do it. I was watching her from the side so I started to say a little prayer to God in my head to help her. Suddenly she went for it and dropped down the slide and I congratulated her at the bottom. Later in the car I asked her what made her decide to go, and she said she wouldn't have done it if I hadn't pushed her down, but I told her that I didn't push her, I wasn't anywhere near her, and she said, well somebody did, cause she could feel hands gently pushing her from behind. But I was watching her the whole time and there was definitly nobody behind her.

3. At uni, I had a phase where I began questioning all religions. I wanted to find the truth and I had been praying to God to reveal which is the true religion to me. Also at the same time I was studying cyberculture. Part of my course was to make a blog and view the blogs of my classmates. Now there was a girl in my class called Sara Larabi who I had a crush on, but I didn't know her blog address. So, at home, I thought I'd just try guessing a few addresses. I tried saralarabi.blogspot.com, and saral.blogspot.com, and then I tried "slarabi.blogspot.com" and to my surprise suddenly a "MEGA-SITE of bible and christian information" popped up. When I checked the url I discovered that I had accidentily missed an 's' out and had written "slarabi.blogpot.com". When I reinserted the 's' it turns out that was also the correct address for sara's blog. It wasn't til I had really reflected on all the small coincidences that had to occur for this to have happened; my crush on sara larabi, both url's differing by just one letter, and for me to have mistyped that one letter, that it really made my head spin. Both urls are still active today if you'd like to check - slarabi.blogpot.com and slarabi.blogspot.com

I have tons of other stories I'd love to tell but I'll leave it there for now.

Now I know what most people are probably thinking, that these can all be explained away with natural explanations, and of course thats a valid possibility but I think there's something deeper and more interesting going on with supernatural stories, in particular the way different people respond to them. Almost everybody has had some kind of experience with the supernatural, whether directly or through stories of others, and we're always left with two choices. To believe or not to believe. But choosing the latter also means that you are choosing to believe something else, which is that the person making the claim is either a liar or a madman. If I chose not to believe the pregnant couple from my church I'd have to justify that choice by insinuating that they were misguided somehow. That they don't questions the facts as well as I do. That they've manipulated the truth, or any other discrediting assumption about their character. Of course sometimes this may very well be the case, people do sometimes lie and people are sometimes misguided, but given the vast number of supernatural claims across the world can I really discredit all of them? That's the question that gets me thinking!

Being the rational and completely uninfluenced by religion person that I am, I definitely went through each of your possibilities and it was very easy to minus the god influence and insert rational explanation. Nothing that I would classify as supernatural by definition has ever happened to me. Great, and moving things may happen but they're nothing more than that. For instance, lots of things make me feel strong emotions. Heck, I could go outside and stand there for a while and feel an immense feeling of peace. Many religious people may attribute that to god telling them that he's there or something of the sort. That's not god though. It's the wind and the air and the sight of nature and everything that goes with that. So for me the choice isn't to believe or not to believe because there is nothing else to believe. A religious explanation doesn't factor in for me.

I'm sure this doesn't discredit any of your experiences for you, and I don't think it should. When people believe in their religion and it's a personal experience for them, then that's great. But when it gets political and when they start judging people outside of themselves and trying to change people and the world in a forceful way, and when there's nothing to change, annnnd when it's used as a tool to influence innocent and impressionable people then that's when I can't stand it.

 

[Emily_G]

Then what would you say about the people who actually claim to be speaking in tongues? It seems that they think they are good christians. Do they have it wrong? (Well, they definitely do and are just speaking jibberish in my opinion. But I'm just interested in a religious view point). A lot of these people have been brought up religious and think they have just as close of a relationship with "god" as you may think.

Oh I'm sure most of them are sincere, good Christians. Just confused about what tongues are, what they were used for, etc.

 

[lunarla]

Oh I'm sure most of them are sincere, good Christians. Just confused about what tongues are, what they were used for, etc.

Well, many are carrying it out and somehow believing that they're speaking some holy language through their god. I'm sure somewhere they know that that's not the case. So I don't see the sincerity in that part of it.

 

[DarkSeeker]

Does any of you ever stop to think that God was Dog spelled backward.

Think on it, that what's I call delicious irony.

 

[diesel]

i think most religions were born out of fear . human beings by nature are inquisative and would eventually start asking the big questions like who are what and what made us . religion provides an answer to these questions - GOD . people are afraid that they may be an insignificant part of evolution , nothing more than a stepping stone in the overall cycle of life .

i myself believe their is a god , im certain of it even though im a sceptical person , but im also open to the fact that it may all be a dream we have "all" concocted and subscribed to .

think about it for a moment if you will . we know that we have evolved from lesser beings and we know that what seperates us from animals is our brains and how they function . we all think we are something special , above everything else around us if ou will . but what if what seperates us from the animals is simple evoultion as well ?? today we are the ultimate predators on this planet , we are at the top of the food chain and not going anywhere anytime soon . but we are still animalistic in behaviour at times . when someone fears for their life chances are their survival instinct will kick in and they will try to survive no matter what the cost . at this time our rational side may go out the window and we become animals . we kill , we fight , we hunt , we dont THINK ,we mostly react . what i mean is we dont act like human beings . humans think , we dont just survive .... because of this we seem to believe that we are above everything else on this planet when really we are possibly the worst thing on this planet as we exploit , destroy and kill everything including the planet itself .

im not a tree hugger so enough of the planet stuff . what im trying to say is that we may not be special but merely a part of something greater . religion , from what i understand , gives the idea that WE are everything . we are the begining and the end . we are the cycle of life you could say . it calms our fears that we are insignificant , unimportant and plain . it feeds our ego's with "solid" beliefs and offers a means of control and grouping . it allows us to be social and feel a part of something bigger than ourselves .

religion is something we invented to explain the inexplicable and to relieve our fears . we then started to try and prove our religious beliefs through stories such as the bible , which is nothing more than a story within a book , and "real" people such as jesus and muhammed who said its all true . we have no reason to believe itor that god really does exist - we just believe .

this is something i have wondered since i was a small child believe it or not and i could write a book on it even though im only 19 ! i regularily look up at the stars and "wait" for something spectacular to happen . im a catholic but i feel i have my own religion . i do not dismiss any other religion or their beliefs . i do not believe in violence in the name of god as it is a contradiction in itself . i do look at the world differently to anyone i know , i look at our species and its flaws and crimes . i believe we are the worst thing to ever happen to this planet but i dont mind either . i myself am a contradiction as i know "we" are not all that and yet i long to be special and feel i may well be . i believe there is a god simply because the unexplainable does happen and someone or something created all this .

this is a short reply believe it or not lol . when i say WE i mean the general population and what i have written is IN MY OPINION ONLY . i hope i havnt offended anyone or their beliefs .
Thank you .

 

[TheManWhoUpholdsHonour]

Through rational logic I acn concur that no one is perfect therefore any idea that comes from a person is flawed and if said idea was carried out it would be litered with....literal wrongness.I can also concur that due to the fact that if god exists he loves us and by my own teaching His emotions would block judgement of you.And through that rational logic.Could you have ever said that the creator of our worlds could have become one with it? Without beginning or end the ring stretches to infinity.

 

[TheManWhoUpholdsHonour]

In Reality,no one is sure.No one is sure of anything.The god could be a flying spaggheti monster and the devil could be a foot.Can anyone tell me how to put a quote under my name?thanks

 

[Emily_G]

Well, many are carrying it out and somehow believing that they're speaking some holy language through their god. I'm sure somewhere they know that that's not the case. So I don't see the sincerity in that part of it.

I don't really know, I've never "spoken in tongues" There is a verse about "tongues of the angels" which is what I think a lot of these people believe they are speaking in. Some unknown langauge only known the God and the angels. But angels in the Bible always spoke in the listener's native language..so that doesn't make sense either.

Does any of you ever stop to think that God was Dog spelled backward.

Think on it, that what's I call delicious irony.

And Santa is Satan is you mix the letters around. I find it hillarious when people use that as a reason why Christians shouldn't celebrate Christmas ::

 

[OPERA]

Can anyone tell me how to put a quote under my name?thanks

you have to PM a mod

I don't really know, I've never "spoken in tongues" There is a verse about "tongues of the angels" which is what I think a lot of these people believe they are speaking in. Some unknown langauge only known the God and the angels. But angels in the Bible always spoke in the listener's native language..so that doesn't make sense either.

were you born into religion or did you come across it later?

 

[Emily_G]

were you born into religion or did you come across it later?

My mom is a Christian, my dad is nothing. Agnostic maybe? Isn't that when you just don't care either way? Not really an atheist, I don't think he knows and I don't think he thinks about it that much. I've never asked him, but if I did ask him if there was a God, I have a feeling he'd say "I don't know". But he's always been respectful of my mom and her beleifs.

I became a Christian when I was 17