If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
- Thread starter Sephiroth
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KiaKaha
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
It depends. Everything really needs to be taken on a case by case basis and scrutinized. I don't necessarily agree that the punishment should equate to the crime - sometimes people do things that dont make sense initially, but after some thought and some time, it may.
I always think that everything can be understood given enough inclination to do so and enough patience - which isnt the same thing as justifying and approving ones behaviour - merely a mechanism to look at things more objectively, without bias and emotion.
In some cases I lean more toward mercy. In other cases I lean toward punishment. It really just depends on what the situation is.
We all make mistakes - we all do stupid things, we all hurt other people on occasion, and sometimes - we all deserve forgiveness and a second chance. He who casts the first stone.
It depends. Everything really needs to be taken on a case by case basis and scrutinized. I don't necessarily agree that the punishment should equate to the crime - sometimes people do things that dont make sense initially, but after some thought and some time, it may.
I always think that everything can be understood given enough inclination to do so and enough patience - which isnt the same thing as justifying and approving ones behaviour - merely a mechanism to look at things more objectively, without bias and emotion.
In some cases I lean more toward mercy. In other cases I lean toward punishment. It really just depends on what the situation is.
We all make mistakes - we all do stupid things, we all hurt other people on occasion, and sometimes - we all deserve forgiveness and a second chance. He who casts the first stone.
Ashiene
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
What about the death penalty? It's part of the justice system but as you said, it's a system based on revenge as well since its a "eye for eye, tooth for tooth" system where you are dealt death as punishment for dealing death to another person.
What about the death penalty? It's part of the justice system but as you said, it's a system based on revenge as well since its a "eye for eye, tooth for tooth" system where you are dealt death as punishment for dealing death to another person.
coyote
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
exactly - that's why it has been abolished by all but a few countries
exactly - that's why it has been abolished by all but a few countries
Lea
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
Agree. I also think ideal world can be achieved only if everyone starts by himself and 1) is completely honest 2) knows how to forgive. Teaching someone a lesson and requiring justice yes, but a system based on cruel revenges would soon turn the planet into battlefield.
Agree. I also think ideal world can be achieved only if everyone starts by himself and 1) is completely honest 2) knows how to forgive. Teaching someone a lesson and requiring justice yes, but a system based on cruel revenges would soon turn the planet into battlefield.
Agent_Violet
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
perhaps if child molesters knew if they raped a child,they'd in turn get raped themselves...maybe that'd be incentive to not do it.
maybe if husband's who beat their wives knew they get the sh*t kicked out of them in return,they'd think twice before beating anyone else.
maybe if those little douchebags who torture and abuse animals knew they would get the same treatment if caught, they'd be too fearful to commit the crime in the first place.
and then again a system based on revenge might just be a bad idea. who really knows.
perhaps if child molesters knew if they raped a child,they'd in turn get raped themselves...maybe that'd be incentive to not do it.
maybe if husband's who beat their wives knew they get the sh*t kicked out of them in return,they'd think twice before beating anyone else.
maybe if those little douchebags who torture and abuse animals knew they would get the same treatment if caught, they'd be too fearful to commit the crime in the first place.
and then again a system based on revenge might just be a bad idea. who really knows.
Lea
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
Some say there is the law of karma and we will have to experience the same sometime (maybe it one of our next lives) what we once inflicted on someone else. Is it true or not? Why this has to be a secret?
Some say there is the law of karma and we will have to experience the same sometime (maybe it one of our next lives) what we once inflicted on someone else. Is it true or not? Why this has to be a secret?
Agent_Violet
Well-known member
Lea
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
I believe there is God, no matter how ridiculous some might find it. Or I don´t know if it´s a belief or rather an intuition. One thing I know for sure, it is not MY job to play God, nor it shouldn´t be a job of anyone else. He said "revenge is mine", I hope it is true.
I believe there is God, no matter how ridiculous some might find it. Or I don´t know if it´s a belief or rather an intuition. One thing I know for sure, it is not MY job to play God, nor it shouldn´t be a job of anyone else. He said "revenge is mine", I hope it is true.
Ashiene
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
lol my country has death penalty. murder = certain death penalty. trafficking of illegal drugs = death penalty (depends on how much drugs though).
lol my country has death penalty. murder = certain death penalty. trafficking of illegal drugs = death penalty (depends on how much drugs though).
coyote
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
for the most part, fear of punishment does not deter crime
people commit crimes because they're desperate, not thinking rationally, or because they don't think they'll be caught in the first place
so promising to beat, or rape, imprison, or kill them has no effect
they're still going to do it anyway
so the punishment is really a way to make the victims (or society as whole) feel better
for the most part, fear of punishment does not deter crime
people commit crimes because they're desperate, not thinking rationally, or because they don't think they'll be caught in the first place
so promising to beat, or rape, imprison, or kill them has no effect
they're still going to do it anyway
so the punishment is really a way to make the victims (or society as whole) feel better
KiaKaha
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
Coyote...
I agree with you wholeheartedly.
I will break out the champagne and cigars.
Coyote...
I agree with you wholeheartedly.
I will break out the champagne and cigars.
Lea
Banned
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
However, in some countries it goes so far that criminal behaviour is regarded as an illness and therefore they´re not punished, but excused which puts further the society at risk. There was this case when a man was punished for putting barbed wire around his garden because he had been broken into numerous times. But he was told that the burglars could harm themselves and therefore he wasn´t suppose to put it there. Cases like this really piss me off.
However, in some countries it goes so far that criminal behaviour is regarded as an illness and therefore they´re not punished, but excused which puts further the society at risk. There was this case when a man was punished for putting barbed wire around his garden because he had been broken into numerous times. But he was told that the burglars could harm themselves and therefore he wasn´t suppose to put it there. Cases like this really piss me off.
coyote
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
as individual animals, human beings are fairly weak
so we've learned to form groups to survive - societies
the members of any given society have an implicit contract with one another
not to harm the other members of society or the society itself
if someone breaks this contract and poses a threat to the well being of the society or any of it's members (including himself), then the society has a duty to the other members (and itself) to stop that individual from posing a threat
if asking nicely doesn't work, what then? coercion? threats? force? removal from society?
at what point does a society's own self-preservation result in society breaking it's contract with the individual members?
how do we preserve the rights of the innocent while preventing the guilty from causing harm?
who is going to be responsible for making the rules? for enforcing them?
if someone isn't willing to do the job, should they have the right to criticize the people who are?
what if the only people willing to do the job aren't necessarily the best people to do it?
as a society gets larger these problems become harder and harder to solve
frankly, i don't think there are any easy answers
and it's okay to accept that it's not always going to be perfect.
but we can always continue to work to make it better for everyone
we have a duty to society to do so
as individual animals, human beings are fairly weak
so we've learned to form groups to survive - societies
the members of any given society have an implicit contract with one another
not to harm the other members of society or the society itself
if someone breaks this contract and poses a threat to the well being of the society or any of it's members (including himself), then the society has a duty to the other members (and itself) to stop that individual from posing a threat
if asking nicely doesn't work, what then? coercion? threats? force? removal from society?
at what point does a society's own self-preservation result in society breaking it's contract with the individual members?
how do we preserve the rights of the innocent while preventing the guilty from causing harm?
who is going to be responsible for making the rules? for enforcing them?
if someone isn't willing to do the job, should they have the right to criticize the people who are?
what if the only people willing to do the job aren't necessarily the best people to do it?
as a society gets larger these problems become harder and harder to solve
frankly, i don't think there are any easy answers
and it's okay to accept that it's not always going to be perfect.
but we can always continue to work to make it better for everyone
we have a duty to society to do so
Last edited:
Rembrandt Broam
Well-known member
Re: If this world worked with a perfect "eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" system
There are two factors that deter premeditated crimes: the punishment, and the probability of getting caught. You can have the most draconian punishment imaginable for the most trivial of crimes, but if the person doesn't believe that there's much chance of ever facing that punishment they won't be deterred. Neither will they care about a high chance of being apprehended if the punishment is no real hardship to them. The two have to work together to be effective.
There are two factors that deter premeditated crimes: the punishment, and the probability of getting caught. You can have the most draconian punishment imaginable for the most trivial of crimes, but if the person doesn't believe that there's much chance of ever facing that punishment they won't be deterred. Neither will they care about a high chance of being apprehended if the punishment is no real hardship to them. The two have to work together to be effective.