username151
Member
Become buddhist. That's what I'll do if I fail to overcome my problems.
How do you remove desire from your life
- Thread starter KiaKaha
- Start date
Aletheia
Well-known member
That's inspiring, Kiwong.
I have a morbid fear of disappointing people and it's led me to run from any expectation at all.
Kiwong
Well-known member
Exactly the same for me, Aletheia, as soon as someone starts to like me, my anxiety is already creating fearful scenarios of how I can possibly upset them and lose their interest.
ohheybbyitscorixx
Well-known member
Everyone has desires. They can range from simple (desire to eat when hungry, desire to breathe to keep from suffocating) to complex (desire for success, desire for fame). Desires are just thoughts unless acted upon. Learn to separate your thoughts from actions, and you may have an easier time coping with this.
If it was that easy we wouldn't be here mate...
we are just to emotionally sensitive and some aren't
atleast you are emotionally sensitive and unique and most creative people
have anxiety and depression problems. life is hard adventure for us but atleast not a boring one
we are just to emotionally sensitive and some aren't
atleast you are emotionally sensitive and unique and most creative people
have anxiety and depression problems. life is hard adventure for us but atleast not a boring one
Invisibleman
Well-known member
hmmm this is so interesting to me.Now granted this is how I see it and it probably makes no sense whatsoever but im just sharing my perspective.
I dont know but to me personally I do believe that removing desire CAN be a helpful thing and a source of motivation. Granted im not saying that this is the way to go or am I condoning it at all but im just saying depending on the individual it can possibly be beneficial.
Listen back when i was a boxer, the fiercest fights that I ever fought were the ones where I had absolutely no desire to win. Going in I would have it set in my mind that I was already going to lose the fight, therefore I wouldnt be so disappointed when I lost because obviously it was the expected outcome. It was at that point I had absolutely nothing to lose, the battle had already been lost and it was a like a massive weight was lifted off of my shoulders.
Since I had nothing to lose it actually made me step outside of my comfort zone and take risks that I would normally never take. I never threw uppercuts,they were always so uncomfortable to me so I never threw them EVER. I went out and i threw flurries of them and kept smashed my oppenents head back. I ended up losing the fight 40-38,but because it was the expected outcome it didnt hurt as much.
Another glaring example that I can think of was this one time with a girl . I went in and I was like "ok this girl is never going to like me,shes way too good for me"blahblahblah. I had already lost the battle and a huge weight was lifted, so I started to relax completely and I started to talk a lot more openly. Conversing with a woman had been the same as those uppercuts, I never took the risk because it was so outside of my comfort zone but I thought what the hell and did it anyway because there was nothing I had to lose at that point.
I dont know,im probably making absolutely no sense whatsoever,actually im facepalming while reading this back but thats just my experience and as i said it probably depends mostly on the individual.
I dunno Kia just something to look into.
I dont know but to me personally I do believe that removing desire CAN be a helpful thing and a source of motivation. Granted im not saying that this is the way to go or am I condoning it at all but im just saying depending on the individual it can possibly be beneficial.
Listen back when i was a boxer, the fiercest fights that I ever fought were the ones where I had absolutely no desire to win. Going in I would have it set in my mind that I was already going to lose the fight, therefore I wouldnt be so disappointed when I lost because obviously it was the expected outcome. It was at that point I had absolutely nothing to lose, the battle had already been lost and it was a like a massive weight was lifted off of my shoulders.
Since I had nothing to lose it actually made me step outside of my comfort zone and take risks that I would normally never take. I never threw uppercuts,they were always so uncomfortable to me so I never threw them EVER. I went out and i threw flurries of them and kept smashed my oppenents head back. I ended up losing the fight 40-38,but because it was the expected outcome it didnt hurt as much.
Another glaring example that I can think of was this one time with a girl . I went in and I was like "ok this girl is never going to like me,shes way too good for me"blahblahblah. I had already lost the battle and a huge weight was lifted, so I started to relax completely and I started to talk a lot more openly. Conversing with a woman had been the same as those uppercuts, I never took the risk because it was so outside of my comfort zone but I thought what the hell and did it anyway because there was nothing I had to lose at that point.
I dont know,im probably making absolutely no sense whatsoever,actually im facepalming while reading this back but thats just my experience and as i said it probably depends mostly on the individual.
I dunno Kia just something to look into.
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Aletheia
Well-known member
equinimity
Brilliant, yes this.
But the term "prepare" suggests a focus on it not turning out, and if that's all that's in your head, it might turn into a prophecy.
Perhaps "be okay with the idea that it may not work out". And equally "be okay with the idea that it may work out". The latter may in fact be harder to do.
Brilliant, yes this.
But the term "prepare" suggests a focus on it not turning out, and if that's all that's in your head, it might turn into a prophecy.
Perhaps "be okay with the idea that it may not work out". And equally "be okay with the idea that it may work out". The latter may in fact be harder to do.
KiaKaha
Banned
Perhaps - this is about as neutral as one can get I think.
I dont know. I kind of feel there is a bit of sugar coating going on here. Now sure, I could put a positive spin on it to convince myself that it aint all that bad - that its all yin and yan - but really the way I see it when you interpret all this down to its core funamental principle - is to expect the worse, and if it works out - a fleeting moment of goodness envelopes you ... and if it doest...well... you already new that anyway. The epitomy of pessimism.
Or maybe I just dont get it.
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Aletheia
Well-known member
Watch it fall away.
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KiaKaha
Banned
^ yeah but it beats being disappointed all the time - I mean, this is the sort of stuff that I have talked about before. What if you *are* disappointed all the time, or even perhaps that you are disappointed for the majortiy of the time... then wouldnt the natural reaction be to just not try anymore? I think we all need to be satisfied to some degree to feel that life is worth living, and to drive us forward. I mean its no surprise that people who have a long list of achievements behind them have more confidence and enjoy life more.... they know that trying has the potential to grant them their desires.
I think for me, the best thing to do - is just to quell as much expectation out of myself as I possibly can - particularly towards things that have the potential to give me pleasure - all the while focusing on the moment at hand to ensure absolute neutrality.
I think for me, the best thing to do - is just to quell as much expectation out of myself as I possibly can - particularly towards things that have the potential to give me pleasure - all the while focusing on the moment at hand to ensure absolute neutrality.
twiggle
Well-known member
Re: equinimity
You're right about the phrasing, yes, being 'okay' with different outcomes is probably a better way of putting it.
Maybe an alternative key to getting over desire is, weirdly, spreading it around a bit more? I think desire is most harmful when we put too much attention on only a few things - for example, if we have our eyes on only one job, or lust after only one person. I guess this fits in with 'being okay with alternative outcomes', but maybe an increased spread of desire means increased chance of satisfaction? A more open mind would surely mean that you can desire a broader range of things which as such you have an increased chance of attaining part of it.
This is a really crude example so apologies but - it's like if you have a really big crush on somebody. The desire may be huge but to let it take over your whole life (or, to make your whole life about that one person), is dangerous and intensifies the consequences of disappointment. Maybe it's more fun to spread that desire over multiple people. Mini-crushes on more people. If they don't work out the disappointment is less in value and hence easier to overcome. Only if one of your crushes begins to reciprocate can you increase the desire for that person to make things go forward.
And the same with general goals in life. Maybe it's best to have several ideas in mind of a particular dream or goal that you'd like to achieve. If you don't succeed with one, then the passion from any disappointment can quickly be transferred towards another goal.
But if you don't have any desire at all... no disappointment ever, but then - neither any satisfaction, nothing to work for.
It's interesting. I've thought about this a lot since I first saw the thread.
You're right about the phrasing, yes, being 'okay' with different outcomes is probably a better way of putting it.
Maybe an alternative key to getting over desire is, weirdly, spreading it around a bit more? I think desire is most harmful when we put too much attention on only a few things - for example, if we have our eyes on only one job, or lust after only one person. I guess this fits in with 'being okay with alternative outcomes', but maybe an increased spread of desire means increased chance of satisfaction? A more open mind would surely mean that you can desire a broader range of things which as such you have an increased chance of attaining part of it.
This is a really crude example so apologies but - it's like if you have a really big crush on somebody. The desire may be huge but to let it take over your whole life (or, to make your whole life about that one person), is dangerous and intensifies the consequences of disappointment. Maybe it's more fun to spread that desire over multiple people. Mini-crushes on more people. If they don't work out the disappointment is less in value and hence easier to overcome. Only if one of your crushes begins to reciprocate can you increase the desire for that person to make things go forward.
And the same with general goals in life. Maybe it's best to have several ideas in mind of a particular dream or goal that you'd like to achieve. If you don't succeed with one, then the passion from any disappointment can quickly be transferred towards another goal.
But if you don't have any desire at all... no disappointment ever, but then - neither any satisfaction, nothing to work for.
It's interesting. I've thought about this a lot since I first saw the thread.
I can't say that I've removed desire from my life... but I think I can say that I've effectively removed (or never learned) the expression of it- and/or the pursuance of it. Maybe it's apathetic, but I don't go after anything, no matter how badly I want it (and in a lot of cases, I'm good at convincing myself that I really don't want it. In the cases I can't fool myself, I console myself with the thought that nobody taught me how to get it, thus absolving myself from blame/shame). It just seems pointless- doomed to failure.
oh i def agree with lowering your expectations..this is a much better route to take as opposed to removing desire..ive lowered my expectations almost too much at this point in my life..i expect very little out of life but in return i seem to get very little as i dont 'try' that hard anymore..
Aletheia
Well-known member
Buddhism does not advocate the suppression of all desires, but rather offers the means to gain freedom from afflictive emotions. The desire for food when one is hungry, the aspiration to work for peace in the world, the thirst for knowledge, the wish to share one's life with dear ones, or the yearning for freedom from suffering: all of these can contribute to lasting happiness as long as they are not tainted by craving and grasping. Like the other emotions, desire can be experienced either in a constructive or in an afflictive way. It can be the catalyst for a meaningful life—or the maelstrom that wrecks it.
Usually, when a desire arises, we either satisfy or repress it. In the first case, we surrender our self-control; in the second case, a painful conflict builds up. The problem with merely satisfying a desire is that we set into motion a self-perpetuating mechanism: the more salty water we drink, the thirstier we feel. This is how we become addicted to the causes of suffering. But once we know how to have a dialogue with our emotions, the intensity and frequency of the mental images that trigger desire will diminish, and having to repress it in any way. The few images that still arise will be like fleeting sparks in the vast expanse of the mind.
(Matthieu Ricard, "Working With Desire", Tricycle Summer 2004)
Usually, when a desire arises, we either satisfy or repress it. In the first case, we surrender our self-control; in the second case, a painful conflict builds up. The problem with merely satisfying a desire is that we set into motion a self-perpetuating mechanism: the more salty water we drink, the thirstier we feel. This is how we become addicted to the causes of suffering. But once we know how to have a dialogue with our emotions, the intensity and frequency of the mental images that trigger desire will diminish, and having to repress it in any way. The few images that still arise will be like fleeting sparks in the vast expanse of the mind.
(Matthieu Ricard, "Working With Desire", Tricycle Summer 2004)
hidwell
Well-known member
Usually, when a desire arises, we either satisfy or repress it. In the first case, we surrender our self-control; in the second case, a painful conflict builds up. The problem with merely satisfying a desire is that we set into motion a self-perpetuating mechanism: the more salty water we drink, the thirstier we feel. This is how we become addicted to the causes of suffering. But once we know how to have a dialogue with our emotions, the intensity and frequency of the mental images that trigger desire will diminish, and having to repress it in any way. The few images that still arise will be like fleeting sparks in the vast expanse of the mind.
This makes a lot of sense to me, unfortunately it also requires one hell of a lot of self discipline.::