Zest for life

[spaceboy135]

Earlier today I was feeling really bored, antsy, wanting to do something CONSTRUCTIVE so I wouldn't feel like a loser (aka no Starcraft 2 or watching my roomie's Simpsons or Seinfeld DVDs). Seriously-- I was writing a huge journal entry wondering if I'd done right in stopping doing so many of my old hobbies for moral reasons. (For example: I don't try to get really buff anymore because I consider it to be a form of self-validation. I also did boxing and powerlifting and youth group ministry for the same reaons-- I omitted everything that was done for any reason other than that it was fun.)

So after I went running at sunset (in which I don't measure distance by miles anymore; I just say "I ran really far away" so I don't have to keep up with how long or far I've run), I came back inside and started drawing a picture of my brother and his wife slow-dancing on their wedding night, using one of their wedding photos on Facebook. I was listening to slow vocal jazz while doing this with my big speakers plugged into my laptop, and I'm telling you, the music and the subject I was drawing fused together like peanut butter and jelly. It was magical. The sweeter the songs were, the more I was in love with the two people in the picture. (No, I'm not gonna post it up here. I'm only a third of the way done with it.)

I think that that cracked open the lid to the boredom box I've been trapped in... Because once I've got my mind thinking creatively and productively instead of vegging out to SPW, television, and games, things start to seep in: like all of a sudden wanting to read a book about Creationism, or go online and do research on Tolstoy (one of my heroes-- we have very similar personalities), write BRIEF philosophical rants in my notebook, etc... This is the way I was this past summer when I was doing lots of research on my favorite authors and working out on my bicycle everyday, playing my $25 piano before the ceiling caved in on it, and working on my novel. I'm not all the way there yet. But zest for life feels attainable again.

Can't wait to be in the music world again. I got a fiddle for Christmas, but don't want to start playing it till I get the shoulder rest in the mail, since it hurts to hold the instrument without it. But now I'm also itching to get my saxophone out of the back of the closet too and take lessons again, because tonight one of the jazz vocalists I heard was Julia Fordham, singing "The World Keeps Spinning". If I could get good enough to make my saxophone sound like her voice, I would never put it down...

 

[fitftw]

Cool that you broke out of your rut. You had me questioning myself for a second because I go to the gym habitually, but I'm pretty sure I enjoy transforming my body. I would like to stop watching so much TV and playing videogames and do something ELSE, but there's nothing else I like to do.

 

[Anomaly]

Strangely enough, I had trouble falling asleep this night. I couldn't resolve my "thoughts for the day" during my hour or so walk. I kept reflecting on my general cynicism, on existentialism (particularly absurdism), and several of Tolstoy's works (in decreasing order of amount of thought given: The Death of Ivan Ilych, A Confession, War and Peace). The idea of a happier life became more realistic to me than it has in the past few years. Mind, it is only a change of opinion, but I consider this fairly significant. After all, it was time for sleep, I was fairly tired, and yet I tossed around in bed for a good 2 hours before being able to sleep.

 

[spaceboy135]

Strangely enough, I had trouble falling asleep this night. I couldn't resolve my "thoughts for the day" during my hour or so walk. I kept reflecting on my general cynicism, on existentialism (particularly absurdism), and several of Tolstoy's works (in decreasing order of amount of thought given: The Death of Ivan Ilych, A Confession, War and Peace). The idea of a happier life became more realistic to me than it has in the past few years. Mind, it is only a change of opinion, but I consider this fairly significant. After all, it was time for sleep, I was fairly tired, and yet I tossed around in bed for a good 2 hours before being able to sleep.

"Restless tonight
'Cause I wasted the light
Maybe next time
But not this time"

I know how you feel. Sometimes I'll come up with the absolute most wonderful ideas of things to do-- at 3am in bed, when it's not the time to do them. Then I forget what they were in the morning...

What were your thoughts on Tolstoy's works?

 

[spaceboy135]

Cool that you broke out of your rut. You had me questioning myself for a second because I go to the gym habitually, but I'm pretty sure I enjoy transforming my body. I would like to stop watching so much TV and playing videogames and do something ELSE, but there's nothing else I like to do.

Think you can explore? Buy extremely cheap musical instruments on craiglist or something? Or if you're so fit, you could take up chess boxing (youtube it... hah... the most recent thing that has me excited)

 

[Anomaly]

"Restless tonight
'Cause I wasted the light
Maybe next time
But not this time"

I know how you feel. Sometimes I'll come up with the absolute most wonderful ideas of things to do-- at 3am in bed, when it's not the time to do them. Then I forget what they were in the morning...

What were your thoughts on Tolstoy's works?

First and foremost, I was disappointed with Tolstoy's "solution" in A Confession. I wrote about it here (particularly in the third paragraph). It was implied in the endnotes that Tolstoy actually came to reject his own solution towards the end of his life. In War and Peace, characters had continual changes in outlook on life -- fairly normal depressive and manic states derived from circumstances. One that really comes out is near the end, where Pierre finds happiness in the worst circumstances he's ever been in his life, which to me appears to be positing absurdism as a solution to the problem of finding a purpose in life, but adds a bit of commentary about the liberty of having no purpose in life. Like the previous example, the solution is unsatisfying, at least to me. In The Death of Ivan Ilych, I was surprised at how much my life has at least thus far led the same path as Ilych's, being in a death-like state. I want to re-read the book again (as it's fairly short) as I feel the message included isn't revealed with a simple read-through.

 

[spaceboy135]

First and foremost, I was disappointed with Tolstoy's "solution" in A Confession. I wrote about it here (particularly in the third paragraph). It was implied in the endnotes that Tolstoy actually came to reject his own solution towards the end of his life. In War and Peace, characters had continual changes in outlook on life -- fairly normal depressive and manic states derived from circumstances. One that really comes out is near the end, where Pierre finds happiness in the worst circumstances he's ever been in his life, which to me appears to be positing absurdism as a solution to the problem of finding a purpose in life, but adds a bit of commentary about the liberty of having no purpose in life. Like the previous example, the solution is unsatisfying, at least to me. In The Death of Ivan Ilych, I was surprised at how much my life has at least thus far led the same path as Ilych's, being in a death-like state. I want to re-read the book again (as it's fairly short) as I feel the message included isn't revealed with a simple read-through.

I've yet to read Ilyich, but War and Peace I got about 200 pages into before I decided I wanted to wait till a better time to read it, since I wasn't yet in a good state to read a long boring book so soon after finishing Anna Karenina-- which bored me out of my mind at times because Tolstoy loves going into detail about every little mundane thing in a character's life, but I persevered and read the whole thing through because I knew the man would have something profound to say that would make the whole book worthwhile.

About A Confession, I felt the same way you did because after it seemed to be building up to something great, he does it for the wrong reasons. I LOVE that he chose to be a Christian simply because the "milliards" before him have found joy in it, and I love that he freely disregarded logic and reason. That to me says, "It's okay to be stupid, even if you're smart." At the time I read that, I was scouring the Internet for scientific/psychological/evolution articles that would validate Christianity, and even though I know that nobody knows anything on this subject, I really wanted to have my own argument to back my faith up. But I didn't like the fact that for every argument there was a counterargument, and I could never tell which side was right (atheists or Christians??). What if one side was just as talented as I was at pulling stuff out of my butt? And how would I be able to tell? More research, right? Well, research on both sides made science appear to be more correct. So I was just sitting in my room going crazy and poring over this stuff for about 10 hours a day, literally losing my mind. Because I didn't want to leave my faith, as ridiculous as I think it is plenty of times-- the Bible is full of ridiculous things, and science and just plain logic make so much more sense to me. But I wanted to stay Christian because my family is Christian, and I love my family and don't want to distance myself from them-- as bad a reason as that might be. (To me it seems like a good reason.)

Then I stumbled upon A Confession... And even though I'm disappointed with his trying to validate being stupid on purpose by way of omitting his argument and saying his argument was wrong (which wasn't wrong-- his argument was perfectly valid! He just gave up), I still got something out of it, and that is that it's okay to be stupid on purpose... as long as you know why you're doing it. Even if there are thousands of absurdities in Christianity, I choose to be one anyway. And if I have good reason to be mad at God for me having SA and him never taking it away from me no matter how many times I've asked, and even if church is a big fat waste of time (which most of the time it is), I choose to go anyway and live a Christian life. Tolstoy gave me permission to be stupid.

I didn't mean to turn this into a religious conversation. I'm just telling you what I thought of A Confession. Thanks for the wonderfully thoughtful response. I really enjoy talking to people like you.

 

[Phoenixx]

Great job breaking out of your rut! I've been stuck in a rut lately too, and I gotta tell ya it sucks. I really should get back into drawing again. I haven't had inspiration in months though.

 

[spaceboy135]

Great job breaking out of your rut! I've been stuck in a rut lately too, and I gotta tell ya it sucks. I really should get back into drawing again. I haven't had inspiration in months though.

Hmmm... Maybe find something or even someone you love... and draw that? Because I didn't have much inspiration either, just forced myself to start it. But it wsa two people I really cared about, so it was easy for me to wanna do it

 

[Anomaly]

About A Confession, I felt the same way you did because after it seemed to be building up to something great, he does it for the wrong reasons. I LOVE that he chose to be a Christian simply because the "milliards" before him have found joy in it, and I love that he freely disregarded logic and reason. That to me says, "It's okay to be stupid, even if you're smart." At the time I read that, I was scouring the Internet for scientific/psychological/evolution articles that would validate Christianity, and even though I know that nobody knows anything on this subject, I really wanted to have my own argument to back my faith up. But I didn't like the fact that for every argument there was a counterargument, and I could never tell which side was right (atheists or Christians??). What if one side was just as talented as I was at pulling stuff out of my butt? And how would I be able to tell? More research, right? Well, research on both sides made science appear to be more correct. So I was just sitting in my room going crazy and poring over this stuff for about 10 hours a day, literally losing my mind. Because I didn't want to leave my faith, as ridiculous as I think it is plenty of times-- the Bible is full of ridiculous things, and science and just plain logic make so much more sense to me. But I wanted to stay Christian because my family is Christian, and I love my family and don't want to distance myself from them-- as bad a reason as that might be. (To me it seems like a good reason.)

Then I stumbled upon A Confession... And even though I'm disappointed with his trying to validate being stupid on purpose by way of omitting his argument and saying his argument was wrong (which wasn't wrong-- his argument was perfectly valid! He just gave up), I still got something out of it, and that is that it's okay to be stupid on purpose... as long as you know why you're doing it. Even if there are thousands of absurdities in Christianity, I choose to be one anyway. And if I have good reason to be mad at God for me having SA and him never taking it away from me no matter how many times I've asked, and even if church is a big fat waste of time (which most of the time it is), I choose to go anyway and live a Christian life. Tolstoy gave me permission to be stupid.

I've had a somewhat similar experience. The argument and counterargument circle was not the reason, but a part of why I took a step back and looked at this from a different angle. Though some people on YouTube tried to portray theism as the default philosophical stance, I could never have accepted that and remained intellectually honest. The compartmentalization of various parts of my life to protect some of them from unadultured logic didn't work for me. Mind, it did take some time, but I reached that point nonetheless. I got tired of having to come up with excuses that I couldn't defend.

 

[spaceboy135]

I've had a somewhat similar experience. The argument and counterargument circle was not the reason, but a part of why I took a step back and looked at this from a different angle. Though some people on YouTube tried to portray theism as the default philosophical stance, I could never have accepted that and remained intellectually honest. The compartmentalization of various parts of my life to protect some of them from unadultured logic didn't work for me. Mind, it did take some time, but I reached that point nonetheless. I got tired of having to come up with excuses that I couldn't defend.

You sound just like my cousin-- he used that exact same wording, "intellectually honest". I totally respect that...

And I've had those exact same feelings before: I was tired of having to defend God for him, and I always felt like I was saving his butt by coming up with excuses for him one after another for every perfectly valid argument. Last year I was atheist for about a week or two from this struggle, but I just felt so bad for my family that I felt like it was necessary for me to believe for them.

Did your SA in any way catalyze your conversion to atheism? It sure did for me (even though I came back). Because it's hard to find use for all the love principles when it's hard for you to think about others anyway when you're near them... But now I tell myself that the poor old lady who put her two cents in the treasury gave more than the rest of the people in the temple did. And so the socially anxious guy's love was worth more than all the rest of the socially proficient members of the church.

 

[Anomaly]

Last year I was atheist for about a week or two from this struggle, but I just felt so bad for my family that I felt like it was necessary for me to believe for them.

Indeed, religion absolutely depends on community. This observation actually drove me further from religion when analyzing it as a standalone philosophical framework. "The presence of god" being confounded with a social phenomenon didn't work too well in favor of theism.

Did your SA in any way catalyze your conversion to atheism? It sure did for me (even though I came back).

I can't say with certainty whether it has -- it is possible that with a strong community of religious people, it would've been less likely for doubts to come up. I also can't quite call myself an atheist as I think agnostic describes me better (both in the traditional sense), but I don't "recoil" at being called one, etc. In certain polls, SA has been mentioned here to be the primary reason why a lot of people are not theists. I don't find the argument from suffering to be very compelling. William Lane Craig (I'm sure you've heard of him) quoted an atheist philosopher in at least one of his debates (I think it was Kai Nielsen), saying that if there is even a chance that god's actions are morally permissible, then the problem of evil is no problem at all.

Because it's hard to find use for all the love principles when it's hard for you to think about others anyway when you're near them... But now I tell myself that the poor old lady who put her two cents in the treasury gave more than the rest of the people in the temple did. And so the socially anxious guy's love was worth more than all the rest of the socially proficient members of the church.

That's actually an interesting perspective on SA, but I can't quite respond as I've had very little people in my life to display/give any love to (SA hardly applies to parents and so forth -- I refer primarily to nonfamilial people).