Moral compass in the brain can be controlled by magnets

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

I find this disturbing. I have to wonder if some military might put this to use on their soldiers or something.

Moral judgments can be altered ... by magnets

“You think of morality as being a really high-level behavior,” she says. “To be able to apply (a magnetic field) to a specific brain region and change people’s moral judgments is really astonishing."

I'm quite curious as to the results of further studies about this.

 

[coyote]

this is why the tin foil helmet is such a good idea

i wear mine all the time anymore

what?

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

You do know that tinfoil will actually act as an antenna and enhance signal strength into your brain rather than block it, right?

ETA: http://berkeley.intel-research.net/arahimi/helmet/

Conclusion

The helmets amplify frequency bands that coincide with those allocated to the US government between 1.2 Ghz and 1.4 Ghz. According to the FCC, These bands are supposedly reserved for ''radio location'' (ie, GPS), and other communications with satellites (see, for example, [3]). The 2.6 Ghz band coincides with mobile phone technology. Though not affiliated by government, these bands are at the hands of multinational corporations.

 

[Pacific_Loner]

I could be over-simplifying their study but isn't it pretty obvious that if you disturb the part of the brain responsible for moral judgments, the owner of the brain will have their judgment biased?

 

[Deus_Ex_Lemur]

How about a lead helmet then?

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

How about a lead helmet then?

Good idea. Evidently a supercooled lead helmet will prevent magnetic fields from affecting your brain. Such a thing might wear on your neck after a while, though.

Supercooled lead hats aid brain scans ? The Register

 

[coyote]

You do know that tinfoil will actually act as an antenna and enhance signal strength into your brain rather than block it, right?

ETA: http://berkeley.intel-research.net/arahimi/helmet/

well, duh

that's what I'm after - amplification

hopefully, and with enough magnets, I can get my moral compass to spin like a pinwheel in a hurricane

life's journey is much more exciting when you don't know which way to go

 

[DanFC]

As the study says, it's not so much of a "control" but more of a "bias". From my understanding of the paper, the TMS (magnets) affects the TPJ (brain region) in such a way that it affects our understanding of intentions. As such, your "moral compass" may not be shifted, but the objective outcome may be different due to a different understanding of the situation.

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

As the study says, it's not so much of a "control" but more of a "bias". From my understanding of the paper, the TMS (magnets) affects the TPJ (brain region) in such a way that it affects our understanding of intentions. As such, your "moral compass" may not be shifted, but the objective outcome may be different due to a different understanding of the situation.

Right. They relied more on the outcome than the act to decide the morality of something. Which is bad.

For example, subjects were asked to judge how permissible it is for a man to let his girlfriend walk across a bridge he knows to be unsafe, even if she ends up making it across safely. In such cases, a judgment based solely on the outcome would hold the perpetrator morally blameless, even though it appears he intended to do harm.

It's almost like it gives you an ends-justifies-the-means bias to your view of things, which could be dangerous if someone was manipulating it.

 

[DanFC]

I guess my point was that the person really isn't doing anything bad or that they was no compromise of morals, it is just misguidance and ends up like every other form of manipulation out there. But yes, it could be dangerous... and/or extremely useful, lol. It would be a good way for a government to get some things going that would otherwise result in protest.

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

I suspect that setting up an experiment where people can do dangerous and/or immoral things might be a bit illegal. ::Though I do recall an interesting experiment where people thought they were hurting other people.

And this seems to have just been a pilot study, but it opens up all manner of possibilities.

 

[DanFC]

I suspect that setting up an experiment where people can do dangerous and/or immoral things might be a bit illegal. ::Though I do recall an interesting experiment where people thought they were hurting other people.

And this seems to have just been a pilot study, but it opens up all manner of possibilities.

That experiment, if I think you are referring to the experiment testing the effect of authority on decision-making and external consequences by having the subject have control over the supposed shock treatment of another person, was done a while ago, it would never get through the IRB today XD

Ah well, time to move to an inconspicuous country to start a lab :-D

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

That experiment, if I think you are referring to the experiment testing the effect of authority on decision-making and external consequences by having the subject have control over the supposed shock treatment of another person, was done a while ago, it would never get through the IRB today XD

That's the one, yes!

Ah well, time to move to an inconspicuous country to start a lab :-D

When I finish cloning my flying monkeys, I'm going to have moral capability entirely removed from their brains, so I won't have to worry about this problem.

 

[coyote]

i don't believe in morals anyway

i think that people do things because they want to do them

we really just act to satisfy the same basic urges as any other animal in the jungle

we assign reasons to our actions - or what we call "morals" - merely to dress them up and make them more pretty or more noble or more palatable

so the more useful experimental tools are the ones that can get people to change their basic urges

i think maybe some parties are already using those....

 

[NathanielWingatePeaslee]

i don't believe in morals anyway

I see where you're coming from, but what is it you think is being altered in the experiment, then? Like in the example I quoted about the guy's girlfriend and the bridge, where he isn't held morally accountable as long as she's okay in the end.

 

[DanFC]

That's the one, yes!


When I finish cloning my flying monkeys, I'm going to have moral capability entirely removed from their brains, so I won't have to worry about this problem.

I hope you have better luck then I did with my hybrid pig-boy. (got to love Archer)

i don't believe in morals anyway

i think that people do things because they want to do them

we really just act to satisfy the same basic urges as any other animal in the jungle

we assign reasons to our actions - or what we call "morals" - merely to dress them up and make them more pretty or more noble or more palatable

so the more useful experimental tools are the ones that can get people to change their basic urges

i think maybe some parties are already using those....

Why dress up our actions with reasons? If it is to make ourselves feel better or to make ourselves seem better with respect to others, does the fact we do not feel as "good" or we do not seem "good" to others as we would otherwise speak to some morals, regardless of it's origin, or otherwise why do we feel this need to dress it up? Or maybe morals are just a means of control, but why then the self-imposing of morals? Eh, I don't know. I'm sure I am missing something there, can someone enlighten me O_O